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H46Bubba 08-29-2009 01:10 PM

JO now has two legal battles to contend with. He still has the case that he filed from last year; which has reconvened since the injuntion was not overturned by Delta's appeal. Delta is now allowed to include new discovery evidence that was left out prior to the injuntion; which is the deleted e-mails on Joe Seratelli's computer and Jorn Bates' stolen laptop with pertenent files. Delta has asked the court to re-deposition Sartelli and Bates at September's hearing. JO has come back with an ammendment to the original case citing Delta knew it's(MAG's) practice of pulling out of coordinated cancellations; operating the aircraft empty and charging them to Delta as four plus hour late completions.

Looking back to March, MAG actually filed against a second case against Delta cancelling their CRJ-900 contract. Delta states that Freedom did not meet the operation commitments required by the contract for completion and on-time flights as well as cancellations due to no crews, spare a/c, and not canceling flights at Delta's request. MAG states it was unfair of Delta to demand that Freedom have a spare a/c. They also state that Delta was supposed to make reasonable accommidations for Freedom's operational needs when establishing flight scheds, and to make adjustments to Freedom's actual completion and on-time arrival rates when operational specifications imposed by Delta (including spares) interfered with Freedom's operations. They claim Delta refused to adjust Freedom's completion and on-time rates, refused to set realistic schedules that reflected JFK extreme operational challenges, and refused to provide operation spares promised in the Agreement that would have enable Freedom to overcome some of the operational challenges.
The new judge said the case was similar to the first case and passed it off to the judge of the first case.
Now Delta has filed against MAG for material breach; which I'm guessing is Freedom offering a bad product, causing Delta to lose customers and revenue. Delta wants a "seemless" product for customers between DCI and Delta mainline. That means aircraft color schemes, matching cabin interiors, first class service and now meals on 76 seat RJ's, and most of all; good customer service.

CrippleHawk 08-29-2009 03:13 PM


Originally Posted by PurpleCRJ (Post 669920)


Cool avatar cripplehawk. I just saw watchmen 2 or 3 days ago.





thanks for the compliments

Seaslap8 08-29-2009 03:51 PM

[quote=flynwmn;669635]It would be great but I don't the Dash could make PHX to ANC. Since we at Piedmont just opened ANC as the ground handlers....Loosing my job so somebody over 60 can keep his


Should the 60 plus guys retire so you don't have to "loose" your job?

PurpleCRJ 08-29-2009 03:57 PM


Originally Posted by H46Bubba (Post 669999)
JO now has two legal battles to contend with. He still has the case that he filed from last year; which has reconvened since the injuntion was not overturned by Delta's appeal. Delta is now allowed to include new discovery evidence that was left out prior to the injuntion; which is the deleted e-mails on Joe Seratelli's computer and Jorn Bates' stolen laptop with pertenent files. Delta has asked the court to re-deposition Sartelli and Bates at September's hearing. JO has come back with an ammendment to the original case citing Delta knew it's(MAG's) practice of pulling out of coordinated cancellations; operating the aircraft empty and charging them to Delta as four plus hour late completions.

Looking back to March, MAG actually filed against a second case against Delta cancelling their CRJ-900 contract. Delta states that Freedom did not meet the operation commitments required by the contract for completion and on-time flights as well as cancellations due to no crews, spare a/c, and not canceling flights at Delta's request. MAG states it was unfair of Delta to demand that Freedom have a spare a/c. They also state that Delta was supposed to make reasonable accommidations for Freedom's operational needs when establishing flight scheds, and to make adjustments to Freedom's actual completion and on-time arrival rates when operational specifications imposed by Delta (including spares) interfered with Freedom's operations. They claim Delta refused to adjust Freedom's completion and on-time rates, refused to set realistic schedules that reflected JFK extreme operational challenges, and refused to provide operation spares promised in the Agreement that would have enable Freedom to overcome some of the operational challenges.
The new judge said the case was similar to the first case and passed it off to the judge of the first case.
Now Delta has filed against MAG for material breach; which I'm guessing is Freedom offering a bad product, causing Delta to lose customers and revenue. Delta wants a "seemless" product for customers between DCI and Delta mainline. That means aircraft color schemes, matching cabin interiors, first class service and now meals on 76 seat RJ's, and most of all; good customer service.


thanks for all that. i don't understand some things though. delta owns the 900's right? how was freedom supposed to have a spare? that is up to delta.

also, i doubt the freedom product is very different than any other code share (except those flying brand new 900's). i figure MAG has plenty of spare erj's and spare pilots; so i don't see what they are lacking really. customer service: like pilots and FA's? everything else is not run by MAG (paint, meals, services, etc.). poor mx could be something . . .

SpiraMirabilis 08-29-2009 10:27 PM

At one point MAG was using an ERJ-145 (or two) as a spare for the 900 operation at their own expense. I do remember that. Not trying to defend MAG or anything, I don't work there anymore, but if Delta wanted a spare they should have designated one as a spare.

rickair7777 08-30-2009 05:33 AM


Originally Posted by SpiraMirabilis (Post 670161)
At one point MAG was using an ERJ-145 (or two) as a spare for the 900 operation at their own expense. I do remember that. Not trying to defend MAG or anything, I don't work there anymore, but if Delta wanted a spare they should have designated one as a spare.

Regionals don't usually contract for spare aircraft. Normally the contract is for X amount of flying, and it is up to the regional to cover it. If they have good Mx, they can use fewer spares, or vice versa, but it is normally up to them.

H46Bubba 08-30-2009 09:38 AM


Originally Posted by PurpleCRJ (Post 670043)
thanks for all that. i don't understand some things though. delta owns the 900's right? how was freedom supposed to have a spare? that is up to delta.

also, i doubt the freedom product is very different than any other code share (except those flying brand new 900's). i figure MAG has plenty of spare erj's and spare pilots; so i don't see what they are lacking really. customer service: like pilots and FA's? everything else is not run by MAG (paint, meals, services, etc.). poor mx could be something . . .

Having a spare can be as easy as airframe utilization for the given schedule. In order to have a spare you might have to fly more lines on your other aircraft or coordinate with Network planning. Where is Delta going to get a spare for Freedom to operate? "Here have one of Comair's 900's so you can operate a flight!" I think both sides' expectations were unreal. Mesa and Freedom's aircraft look like crap on the interior. JO has never been much for upkeep. I remember when UA came to us and said we need to make sure the UAX a/c carpets and cargo bins were always in tip top shape. JO complied just because UA is his bread and butter contract and new he could pass on the expense to UA. The only time he didn't have a fit over interiors was when we painted and remoded the interiors of the Indy Air CRJ's MAG leased for go! Of course he made she we did it as cheaply as possible because it was coming out of MAG's pocket!:rolleyes:

SpiraMirabilis 08-30-2009 11:19 PM


Originally Posted by rickair7777 (Post 670210)
Regionals don't usually contract for spare aircraft. Normally the contract is for X amount of flying, and it is up to the regional to cover it. If they have good Mx, they can use fewer spares, or vice versa, but it is normally up to them.

In this contract Delta was providing the aircraft, leasing them to Mesa for $1 a month.

Was Mesa expected to buy a 900 on their own dime to use as a spare? Oh wait, yeah since there was a queue even if they did it wouldn't arrive for about a year and a half. :confused:

minimwage4 08-31-2009 01:44 AM

Mesa news is imminent this week, heard from someone inside. look for it..

travelnate 08-31-2009 05:37 AM


Originally Posted by rickair7777 (Post 670210)
Regionals don't usually contract for spare aircraft. Normally the contract is for X amount of flying, and it is up to the regional to cover it. If they have good Mx, they can use fewer spares, or vice versa, but it is normally up to them.

Rick, unfortunately that's not how it is.

On a Fee-for-departure, the host carrier has to pay for *everything*.. including spares & downtime for maintenance. In the Mesa-USAir world, there should be 1 spare in PHX and 1 in CLT - what I can't tell you is if that includes 1 bird in MX at the same time or not.


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