New TA is out.
07-30-2018, 04:59 AM
#21
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Jun 2013
Posts: 110
Originally Posted by MantisToboggan
We all had different expectations on this TA.
Yet you're the only one here mocking people with a different mindset than you rather than providing reasoning behind your thinking. Grow up.
Yet you're the only one here mocking people with a different mindset than you rather than providing reasoning behind your thinking. Grow up.
The point behind my tongue in cheek remark is that, as pilots, I don’t think we’ll ever be happy. We could get paid infinite amounts of money and have every day off that we could ever want and we’d still complain about something.
The committee worked hard, got us a few good things, and gave up a few good things. I think that the extra money as captain would make me feel a bit better when getting extended or juniored. But that’s just me. I think it’s also important to realize that staffing is most definitely an issue now, but the training department IS catching up, AND we’re only slated for what, 57 planes total? Our hiring is slowly catching up to our orders which (at least in theory), would reduce the number of JMs.
Idk, I’m an idiot and don’t think gud sometimes. So take that for what it’s worth.
07-30-2018, 05:10 AM
#22
Banned
Joined APC: Feb 2016
Posts: 761
Originally Posted by 4thgenaviator
Hey, did you see that?! It was the joke going right over your head!
The point behind my tongue in cheek remark is that, as pilots, I don’t think we’ll ever be happy. We could get paid infinite amounts of money and have every day off that we could ever want and we’d still complain about something.
The committee worked hard, got us a few good things, and gave up a few good things. I think that the extra money as captain would make me feel a bit better when getting extended or juniored. But that’s just me. I think it’s also important to realize that staffing is most definitely an issue now, but the training department IS catching up, AND we’re only slated for what, 57 planes total? Our hiring is slowly catching up to our orders which (at least in theory), would reduce the number of JMs.
Idk, I’m an idiot and don’t think gud sometimes. So take that for what it’s worth.
The point behind my tongue in cheek remark is that, as pilots, I don’t think we’ll ever be happy. We could get paid infinite amounts of money and have every day off that we could ever want and we’d still complain about something.
The committee worked hard, got us a few good things, and gave up a few good things. I think that the extra money as captain would make me feel a bit better when getting extended or juniored. But that’s just me. I think it’s also important to realize that staffing is most definitely an issue now, but the training department IS catching up, AND we’re only slated for what, 57 planes total? Our hiring is slowly catching up to our orders which (at least in theory), would reduce the number of JMs.
Idk, I’m an idiot and don’t think gud sometimes. So take that for what it’s worth.
So you want to open up a big old loophole in the contract because it maybe won't be an issue when/if we stop taking jets? Don't think of these contract issues only in the light of how they affect just yourself. The repercussions of this vote will affect everyone who comes here until a new one is put in place.
Ever wonder why our contract is so bad? It's has so many holes it makes swiss cheese look solid.
Because people ignored loopholes thinking the company wouldn't take advantage of them when times got tough. Time's will get tough, probably tougher than now. And they will have you flying an extra turn at the end of every single four day if it's what it takes to avoid cancelling flights.
07-30-2018, 05:26 AM
#23
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Jun 2013
Posts: 110
Originally Posted by MantisToboggan
The joke went right over my head, yet you shot right back reversing your wrong. Hmmmm.
Originally Posted by MantisToboggan
So you want to open up a big old loophole in the contract because it maybe won't be an issue when/if we stop taking jets? Don't think of these contract issues only in the light of how they affect just yourself. The repercussions of this vote will affect everyone who comes here until a new one is put in place.
Ever wonder why our contract is so bad? It's has so many holes it makes swiss cheese look solid.
Because people ignored loopholes thinking the company wouldn't take advantage of them when times got tough. Time's will get tough, probably tougher than now. And they will have you flying an extra turn at the end of every single four day if it's what it takes to avoid cancelling flights.
Ever wonder why our contract is so bad? It's has so many holes it makes swiss cheese look solid.
Because people ignored loopholes thinking the company wouldn't take advantage of them when times got tough. Time's will get tough, probably tougher than now. And they will have you flying an extra turn at the end of every single four day if it's what it takes to avoid cancelling flights.
Look, in the end, I don’t want anyone to get screwed over by bad language. I’m undecided as of yet on my vote. Just trying to play devil’s advocate. If the pilot group truly feels slighted by this TA, let’s vote it down.
Last edited by 4thgenaviator; 07-30-2018 at 05:37 AM.
07-30-2018, 05:48 AM
#24
Banned
Joined APC: Feb 2016
Posts: 761
Originally Posted by 4thgenaviator
I don’t understand this logic. Everyone here, and I mean EVERYONE, b*tches about how AWFUL the schedules are, how little time off they have, how much the company takes advantage of them, how little they get paid compared to everyone else, how they hate flying the jet, blah blah blah blah. This TA offers a SMALL opportunity to have a couple of those things improved. But it seems that the pilot group would rather have it be status quo, have the company say “oh well!” and then we wait until 2022 or whenever the contract is up. I don’t get it.
I would be amiss to say that this TA would not bring us some small improvements:
A pay raise for myself would obviously better than no pay raise. On the flip side of that coin, my FOs get nothing, and I am still paid at the lowest rate in the industry. That is insulting, and I am more than happy to stay at my current pay rate almost purely on principle.
The whole 12 days off deal is really no different than what we have now. They'll find a way to exploit the new language, probably by building five day pairings that go into the first day of the next month. Hello standby days. If you think they won't do that, look at what they do now. They will exploit this.
The company doesn't even pay you correctly for the flying you currently do. You expect them to give you your $250? Have fun with that. "There will be a streamlined process, we promise" HAHAHAHA
Trip efficiency..... BL has already been doing this. He's been doing more outside of negotiations than ANYTHING in this TA. Thanks BL, no thanks TA.
The best part about being an FO and the part I miss most was getting displaced. This is a huge loss for them.
5 hours for a JRMN, holy moly. That is a non-starter. Have fun flying an extra two legs on every day four. If you think they won't exploit you like that, well, you simply haven't been at PDT long enough. The repercussions of a 5 hour JRMN will linger at this place FOREVER. Don't do that to yourself, but most importantly don't do it to the future PDT pilots.
07-30-2018, 06:31 AM
#26
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Dec 2015
Position: Professional Eugoogoolizer at the Derek Zoolander Center For Kids Who Can’t Read Good
Posts: 1,191
My pay raise after taxes still amount to about 1200 dollars after taxes it is about 700.. assuming i credit 1000 hours in a year...
I have been jrm capped for a month now.. i am sure to call them on their bs when they try extend me now on go home day. And i now say triple isn't enough.. Call a reserve and politely say goodbye.. both times they immediately called me back.. got a trade back day off pay protected and the triple. Than that day i dropped i agreed to work it out triple again..
I'm sorry but the 700 dollars isn't worth worrying every trip if I'm going home as planned.
10k extra pay is a different story.
I have been jrm capped for a month now.. i am sure to call them on their bs when they try extend me now on go home day. And i now say triple isn't enough.. Call a reserve and politely say goodbye.. both times they immediately called me back.. got a trade back day off pay protected and the triple. Than that day i dropped i agreed to work it out triple again..
I'm sorry but the 700 dollars isn't worth worrying every trip if I'm going home as planned.
10k extra pay is a different story.
07-30-2018, 06:32 AM
#27
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Jun 2013
Posts: 110
Originally Posted by MantisToboggan
I wold attribute it to big picture mindset versus, well, small picture.
I would be amiss to say that this TA would not bring us some small improvements:
A pay raise for myself would obviously better than no pay raise. On the flip side of that coin, my FOs get nothing, and I am still paid at the lowest rate in the industry. That is insulting, and I am more than happy to stay at my current pay rate almost purely on principle.
I would be amiss to say that this TA would not bring us some small improvements:
A pay raise for myself would obviously better than no pay raise. On the flip side of that coin, my FOs get nothing, and I am still paid at the lowest rate in the industry. That is insulting, and I am more than happy to stay at my current pay rate almost purely on principle.
Originally Posted by MantisToboggan
The whole 12 days off deal is really no different than what we have now. They'll find a way to exploit the new language, probably by building five day pairings that go into the first day of the next month. Hello standby days. If you think they won't do that, look at what they do now. They will exploit this.
The company doesn't even pay you correctly for the flying you currently do. You expect them to give you your $250? Have fun with that. "There will be a streamlined process, we promise" HAHAHAHA
Trip efficiency..... BL has already been doing this. He's been doing more outside of negotiations than ANYTHING in this TA. Thanks BL, no thanks TA.
The best part about being an FO and the part I miss most was getting displaced. This is a huge loss for them.
5 hours for a JRMN, holy moly. That is a non-starter. Have fun flying an extra two legs on every day four. If you think they won't exploit you like that, well, you simply haven't been at PDT long enough. The repercussions of a 5 hour JRMN will linger at this place FOREVER. Don't do that to yourself, but most importantly don't do it to the future PDT pilots.
The company doesn't even pay you correctly for the flying you currently do. You expect them to give you your $250? Have fun with that. "There will be a streamlined process, we promise" HAHAHAHA
Trip efficiency..... BL has already been doing this. He's been doing more outside of negotiations than ANYTHING in this TA. Thanks BL, no thanks TA.
The best part about being an FO and the part I miss most was getting displaced. This is a huge loss for them.
5 hours for a JRMN, holy moly. That is a non-starter. Have fun flying an extra two legs on every day four. If you think they won't exploit you like that, well, you simply haven't been at PDT long enough. The repercussions of a 5 hour JRMN will linger at this place FOREVER. Don't do that to yourself, but most importantly don't do it to the future PDT pilots.
07-30-2018, 10:05 AM
#29
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Dec 2015
Position: Professional Eugoogoolizer at the Derek Zoolander Center For Kids Who Can’t Read Good
Posts: 1,191
Originally Posted by flysooner9
Any idea when the actual vote will happen?
07-30-2018, 10:17 AM
#30
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Nov 2008
Posts: 1,723
Originally Posted by MKUltra
Probably next month.. also those who vote will have to be decided apon. Our contact and fom have conflicting information about who is on probation.. so this would apply to you.
