FirstClass

Currently the flow at envoy is 16 years, ie 1999 pilots are moving to American. You keep saying six years but you have FO's on reserve for 4 years and it takes more than 6 years currently at envoy to upgrade to captain.

Why is it ok for you to project 6 year flows at envoy but psa cannot do the same? You on the other hand feel perfectly justified in "projecting" 20 years at psa. I don't know if we even have a 20 year pilot on the seniority list. Pilots are actually moving to AA at psa much sooner than 20 years right now.

Newbies, see the difference here? I like the envoy guys but that doesn't mean they are going to stop shrinking. I wish I could do something about it.

In summary, if you are looking for a flow through program, envoy is the fastest path to AA at 16 years. There is currently not another carrier flowing pilots to mainline faster than envoy at 16 years. It might be worth a try if you think you can last that long, at least you will be guaranteed.

On the flip side, if flow is not that important to you, psa has a fast upgrade right now to captain. If you got the time you can be hired right into the captain seat of some brand new airplanes at 68 per hour. If you don't have the time, its still a pretty good upgrade less than two years. Pretty much as soon as you have your 121 sic time you will upgrade.

There is something for everyone at psa and envoy, just depends on what's important to you.

Bob Loblaw

You're comparing apples to oranges.

FirstClass

Well they're both delicious and good for you.

TallFlyer

20,000 retirements at mainline in the next decade.

Whoever thinks the situation at the regionals is going to stay the same in that time period needs to seriously think about skipping their next drug test.


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gold

At the moment, flow to American from PSA is 11 years(Envoy is 16). Next year, it will decrease to 9.5 years. By the end of 2016, early 2007 hires will start flowing to American. Some 2007 hires at Envoy can't even hold captain right now. Currently, upgrade times at Envoy are eight years(longest in the industry besides expressjet and endeavor).

eaglefly

The first sentence of this post is speculation based on assumptions and projections. The rest is steaming horse****. I'm at AA and there is no jihad against any particular regional pilots.

Waitingformins

Why are you spinning this situation? Eagle has had over 800 guys quit, that would help any company's flow. Also the 64,000 question is, ARE they going to shrink Envoy to a <500 pilot airline? Please answer why you think yes or no because as any potential new hire would understand it wouldn't be to fun to ride that wave down.

Every mainline guy has told me all airline politics are nasty and always have been, but no one really cares about the regional bs.

air101

Bottom line is that Envoy has to be able to hire for the flow to continue past the 824 guys at the current rate.... they aren't just going to let the whole list flow without hiring people to replace them unless the end game is to just shut down Envoy flight ops. This is why you and all the other clowns are on here trying your hardest to persuade people to apply at Envoy. It's pretty damn obvious to anyone with half a brain.