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02-11-2019 | 07:50 PM

#41

rickair7777

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From: Engines Turn or People Swim

Quote:

Originally Posted by dera

From our class of 31, we had 4 checking event failures, all of them were military guys.
They won't be at a major in anywhere near 1-2 years.

If assume you're at a regional, or LCC. You're only seeing mil guys who are relatively weak or seriously not current.

The ones getting scooped up by the big six are not struggling at all

But if it makes you feel better...

02-11-2019 | 08:02 PM

#42

Varsity

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Joined: May 2017

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From: 175 CA

Quote:

Originally Posted by rickair7777

If assume you're at a regional, or LCC. You're only seeing mil guys who are relatively weak or seriously not current.

The ones getting scooped up by the big six are not struggling at all

But if it makes you feel better...

The big 6 typically have much easier training programs. In the first 8 months of 2018, southwest only had 1 person fail to complete training.

Regionals business model is built around washing the weak ones out.

02-11-2019 | 08:04 PM

#43

dera

In a land of unicorns

Joined: Apr 2014

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From: Whale FO

Quote:

Originally Posted by rickair7777

If assume you're at a regional, or LCC. You're only seeing mil guys who are relatively weak or seriously not current.

The ones getting scooped up by the big six are not struggling at all

But if it makes you feel better...

The point I was trying to make was, that spend your short time at regionals wisely. If you fail in training, it will slow down your progression.

These guys were all mil aviators (from very varied backgrounds. C130, 737 etc). Point wasn't that military guys aren't up to it (which would obviously be completely false), but that if you have a fresh 121 failure, it will likely outweigh your military background for a while when moving to the big league.

I don't believe the mil guys go straight to the big 6 with zero 121 time and no ATP. You need ATP to even start the application.

02-11-2019 | 09:03 PM

#44

MidnightHauler

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Joined: Apr 2014

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Quote:

Originally Posted by stabapch

The majority of rampers at major airports are understaffed. Yes, just like in any other job, including pilots, there are lazy people out there as well. But, I sure wouldn’t generalize. Most of these guys are literally running from gate to gate with no chance to catch a breath. Sucks for us, but you can only play the cards you’re dealt.

No, that's not the issue I'm talking about. Many have seen it firsthand over and over. There is no hustle, urgency, or running of any kind. Just the opposite. They see a plane coming, then drag a** when it approaches the gate, THEN decide to brief their job. There's been countless instances of rampers deliberately standing around, looking at the airplanes sitting at gates, then dragging their feet while causing late arrivals pulling into the parking spot. It's utter nonsense.

02-11-2019 | 09:06 PM

#45

MidnightHauler

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Quote:

Originally Posted by TheWeatherman

Understaffed and underpaid.

So we should just empathize and make excuses for them not doing their job they applied for? Yeah, that'll improve things.

02-12-2019 | 04:38 AM

#46

TheWeatherman

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Quote:

Originally Posted by MidnightHauler

So we should just empathize and make excuses for them not doing their job they applied for? Yeah, that'll improve things.

I bet you don't tip van drivers, eh?

02-12-2019 | 04:40 AM

#47

amcnd

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Quote:

Originally Posted by Varsity

SWA also hires regional check airman with 10k plus hours. Not 172 drivers with 1000 and 25 multi...

02-12-2019 | 05:33 AM

#48

rickair7777

Prime Minister/Moderator

Joined: Jan 2006

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From: Engines Turn or People Swim

Quote:

Originally Posted by Varsity

This is sort of true, but mil guys are rarely "weak"... they would have been flushed before wings (there is of course a rare exception to every rule) The majors have training programs that are mostly designed to accommodate a mil aviator who has no 121 or transport experience. The biggest mistake a mil guy will make is to assume airline, or especially regional, training is going to be easy. As long as they put in at least half the effort they did in the mil, they'll be fine. And like anyone else they must check any attitude at the door

02-12-2019 | 05:34 AM

#49

rickair7777

Prime Minister/Moderator

Joined: Jan 2006

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From: Engines Turn or People Swim

Quote:

Originally Posted by amcnd

SWA also hires regional check airman with 10k plus hours. Not 172 drivers with 1000 and 25 multi...

And they get their pick of the LCA...

02-12-2019 | 05:53 AM

#50

rickair7777

Prime Minister/Moderator

Joined: Jan 2006

Posts: 45,132

Likes: 797

From: Engines Turn or People Swim

Quote:

Originally Posted by dera

Yes a training bust will set them back for sure, and I counsel all of my young guys on that when they take a regional class date.

Quote:

Originally Posted by dera

I don't believe the mil guys go straight to the big 6 with zero 121 time and no ATP. You need ATP to even start the application.

The majority of airline-bound mil separations right now get picked up by a major. They have to get their own ATP first, and there are programs which provide that service. They don't need any 121 time.

The younger folks with less total time due to some career diversion, or too much helo time, or a black mark are the ones going to regionals.

Right now, even non-current, retired senior officers are getting scooped up. Recency used to be a show stopper, but no longer if your whole person package is good enough... they seem to be using rank to quantify that now.