Connect and get the inside scoop on Airline Companies

Welcome to Airline Pilot Forums - Connect and get the inside scoop on Airline Companies

If this is your first visit, be sure to check out the FAQ. Join our community today and start interacting with existing members. Registration is fast, simple and absolutely free.


User Tag List

Post Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Old 05-06-2007, 09:52 PM   #11  
Line Holder
 
mooseflyer's Avatar
 
Joined APC: Apr 2007
Posts: 65
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by АЕРОФЛОТ 214 View Post
interview with hr rep former NWA pilot.

That says a lot.
mooseflyer is offline  
Old 05-07-2007, 09:19 AM   #12  
Gets Weekends Off
 
Ftrooppilot's Avatar
 
Joined APC: Nov 2006
Position: Body at sea level; heart at 70,000+
Posts: 1,032
Default

I'm Curious.

This ia a REGIONAL discussion group wherein Compass is "touted" as a new NWA regional . Reading the threads on most regional interviews reveals that applications, interviews, hiring notification, and report for training dates are compressed into days and weeks and rarely more than two months. LTPs (said with respect) are finding positions .

Now lets look at some differences at Compass:

Address in VA, interviewing in MSP (at Mesaba training Center)
Interviewing with NWA HR
Interviewing high time pilots (4000 - 8000 hrs) only
Candidates pay hotel and "other then airline" transport / expenses
Screening on 727 sim (steam gages ?)
Alpa negotiation ongoing to make Mesaba + Compass one "pilot group"
Actual "begin operations" have been shifting for months.

All this for a 76 seat EMB-175. Mesaba will be flying a 76 seat CRJ-900.

Has any pilot been hired (notified in writing) or is everyone in a "pool ?"

Will the ERJs be assigned to NWA not Compass? Will these high time applicants be offered employment at NWA under a different pay scale? Will the requirement for a ALPA one pilot Mesaba/Compass pilot group disappear ?

Lots of food for thought !

Last edited by Ftrooppilot; 05-07-2007 at 09:42 AM.
Ftrooppilot is offline  
Old 05-07-2007, 09:34 AM   #13  
Gets Weekends Off
 
Past V1's Avatar
 
Joined APC: Oct 2006
Position: Home with my family playing with my daughter as much as possible
Posts: 588
Default

Will the requirement for a ALPA one pilot Mesaba/Compass pilot group dissapear ?

Lots of food for thought ![/quote]

Or will NWA simply ,in the future of course, put Compass and Mesaba under one umberalla? It seems practical to have one regional that a legacy carrier owns...also it seems that the trend is to get rid of your regionals...Delta and ASA and Comair for example. Maybe the plan is NWA will build up the two regionals and put them together and sell them...More food for thought

Not trying to hijack the tread...
Past V1 is offline  
Old 05-07-2007, 10:22 AM   #14  
Gets Weekends Off
 
Joined APC: Nov 2005
Posts: 1,425
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Past V1 View Post
Maybe the plan is NWA will build up the two regionals and put them together and sell them...More food for thought.
NWA already plans on selling compass, in a few years, in a public spin off. I could imagine the same with Mesaba. Think of it as "side income" for an airline. Beat up your regional feeder's stock price, buy it out, give it more feed, go public, sell off your own stock, then rinse and repeat .
fosters is offline  
Old 05-07-2007, 11:16 AM   #15  
Chief Jeppesen Updater
 
FlyerJosh's Avatar
 
Joined APC: Oct 2005
Position: Executive Transport Driver
Posts: 3,047
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ftrooppilot View Post
Actual "begin operations" have been shifting for months.
Compass began actual operations on May 2nd. They operate two round trips a day on the CRJ between IAD and MSP. They are using the callsign "Canadair 601XJ" currently since they don't yet have an ICAO approved callsign.

http://flightaware.com/live/flight/N601XJ


Quote:
Has any pilot been hired (notified in writing) or is everyone in a "pool ?"
They have hired pilots for the CRJ. I believe the first class contained about 6-8 line pilots. With the exception of those pilots and management/training pilots, there are no other line pilots on the property right now. The first EMB-175 classes will be held in June.

Quote:
Will the ERJs be assigned to NWA not Compass? Will these high time applicants be offered employment at NWA under a different pay scale? Will the requirement for a ALPA one pilot Mesaba/Compass pilot group disappear ?

Lots of food for thought !
Both Compass and NWA Mainline are slated to receive Embraer aircraft (IIRC 175's at Compass and 190's at NWA, but don't hold me to that). There is a ratio of aircraft that will go to each company based upon previously ratified side letters of agreement between NWA MEC and management. Pilots flying at Compass will fly for there until either hired off the street at NWA or they become eligible for the flow through (2 years as CA).

At that point, (under the current agreement) they will be eligible to be placed as a new hire at NWA, with seniority and pay established from that period in accordance with the CBA in effect at NWA.
FlyerJosh is offline  
Old 05-07-2007, 11:24 AM   #16  
Gets Weekends Off
 
crewdawg52's Avatar
 
Joined APC: Jan 2006
Position: Right Seat 744
Posts: 932
Default

Along one, but here is the most recent info.



COMPASS AIRLINES

The Compass Negotiating Sub-Committee has prepared this ATT to inform you on a number of issues concerning the Compass start up. We will cover the Mediation/Arbitration that took place to conclude the process, the certification and start‚€‘up of Compass, the initial participation in the flow through to Compass, and lastly, rumors and facts regarding Compass.



NEGOTIATIONS

ALPA‚€™s representation of Compass Airlines pilots did not result from any normal process. Northwest Airlines‚€™ management entered bankruptcy in September 2005. A concession that they sought from the Northwest pilots in the 1113 negotiations was an exception to the Scope language to permit the operation of large regional aircraft at an affiliate. The Northwest pilots negotiated a ‚€œflow through‚€Ě agreement that is unique in ALPA. The flow permits Northwest furloughed pilots to flow ‚€œdown‚€Ě to Compass. Also, new hire Compass pilots are able to flow ‚€œup‚€Ě into Northwest new hire positions. Another portion of the Agreement provided for recognition of ALPA as the collective bargaining representative.



Contained within our current contract is a Letter of Agreement (2006-07) that set the specific guidelines for the negotiation of the first Compass contract. This LOA set a timeline for the completion of the contract. In addition to establishing a process to conclude the first Compass pilot contract, the LOA resolved the majority of the economic issues, including pay rates. These agreed-to provisions had to be drafted into contract text.



Negotiations between ALPA and Compass, pursuant to the LOA, began in August 2006. Mediation began in February 2007 and ended on March 1, 2007. With the assistance of mediator Maggie Jacobsen, the parties reached TAs on all but two Sections. Issues remaining in Section 1 (Scope) and Section 27 (Insurance) went to interest arbitration on April 10, 2007. Several of these issues are to be resolved based on an industry standard. The standard is comprised of eight regional carriers operating 70-seat aircraft. Other issues require an interpretation of LOA 2007-06. The arbitrator‚€™s decision is expected by early June. Currently, the contract is being proofed to be printed and posted electronically. Additionally, clarification and implementation issues are being handled.



THE START-UP

Compass announced on April 5 that they had received FAA certification to begin commercial passenger operations. The first flight was conducted on May 2, 2007 with a CRJ-200, 50-seat aircraft. The route was between IAD and MSP. Compass is expecting to enter the EMB-175 into revenue service in the third quarter of 2007. The CRJ-200 flying will be done by Compass management pilots. Compass will no longer operate the CRJ-200 when the EMB-175 begins operations.



Northwest has informed ALPA that the first pilot base will be in MSP. The scheduled aircraft deliveries begin with one in June 2007 and an additional aircraft in July 2007 and August 2007. Then the deliveries will be two per month to follow until the order is complete.



STAFFING AND FLOW THROUGH

Part of the agreement includes a flow through to NWA by new hire Compass pilots. This also includes a flow down by NWA pilots to Compass in the event of a furlough. As NWA has pilots currently on furlough, they have been permitted to exercise this right as Compass starts up. This flow down is designed to be a safety net, a place to go without looking for a job. If, in the future, an NWA pilot receives a furlough notice, they will simply exercise an EPL to work at Compass. Bear in mind, no one is forced to work at Compass; it is not a requirement to be considered for recall at NWA.



Hundreds of currently furloughed Northwest pilots received an opportunity to flow to Compass. These same pilots have now received a Preliminary Notice to Recall at Northwest. A handful of these pilots are scheduled to start class at Compass. Many have deferred class dates to later months. The first class will begin in May. The class will be for six captains. One Northwest furloughed pilot will be in that class. Classes are scheduled weekly into the future. Indoctrination and some ground school will be conducted via distance learning. The remaining ground school will be in Minneapolis, and the flight training will be conducted in Montreal.



The issues most furloughed NWA pilots will be concerned with are seniority, pay and tenure at Compass. These pilots will be placed at Compass in seniority order. If they hold a captain‚€™s position, they will not be placed on probation at Compass. They will be entitled to return to NWA after one year at Compass if their seniority will hold a position at NWA at that time. A pilot can be ‚€œheld‚€Ě at Compass for a period of time to address staffing issues. This time, however, will be paid at the rate of their awarded position at NWA, and they will also be allotted their NWA defined contribution. The pay rates while employed at Compass have already been established and are part of the LOA. (See enclosed tables.)



The flow through will not allow current NWA pilots to ‚€œdown‚€Ě or ‚€œback bid‚€Ě to Compass. You must be a furloughed NWA pilot in order to exercise the flow down agreement.



In the future, a Compass pilot that was originally hired at Compass will be permitted to ‚€œflow up‚€Ě to Northwest. They will have the opportunity to advance to NWA at first year pay and a new year of probation. If they decide against doing this, they will retain their position at Compass and will not be subject to being displaced if a future furloughed NWA pilot should decide to execute their placement right at Compass via the flow through.



CONTRACT ISSUES

The question has been asked as to why ALPA negotiated a contract for an affiliate. Northwest pilots are concerned about encroachment or creep into our mainline flying. Although it is disappointing that we no longer count 76-seat aircraft as mainline flying, it is imperative to know what we lost is limited, and we have contractual items that limit the growth and fractionalization of our flying. The Compass contract will be a contract for NWA pilots who take jobs at CPS now or in the future.



The industry has and will continue to apply upward pressure on every Scope clause that is under contract. Managements around the world view these restrictions within pilots‚€™ contracts as a ‚€œpox.‚€Ě The LOAs were our response to an aggressive management while negotiating in the environment of bankruptcy. Remember that USAir lost their scope until one year after bankruptcy. They lost the 100-seat flying to Republic last fall because of that restriction on their Section 1. The USAirways pilots only regained this flying through the merger with America West.



The growth of Compass, or any other affiliate that flies aircraft which seat 51 to 76 passengers, is limited after the initial 90 aircraft are acquired based on growth at mainline NWA. Of the 90 total aircraft, up to 36 can be operated by Mesaba Airlines to replace the original 36 AVROs. This can be done without any NWA furloughed pilots having rights to that flying. Through negotiations, three categories of feeder carrier flying were established. Category 1 is Compass. All current and future furloughed NWA pilots have rights to 100 percent of these jobs. Category 2 refers to a carrier that operates the 51- to 76‚€‘seat aircraft while NWA finances those aircraft. NWA furloughed pilots are entitled to half of the captain and half of the first officer positions that those aircraft create. Lastly, Category 3 is the carriers that finance the 51- to 76-seat aircraft on their own. A preferential hiring process is afforded to all furloughed NWA pilots for these jobs. The thought process in negotiating these categories was to create job opportunities for our furloughed pilots while enticing feeder carriers to ‚€œfinance‚€Ě their aircraft on their own.



The LOAs have also reduced the potential of whipsawing our two pilot groups. With the flow up arrangement, Compass pilots will see little need to acquire larger aircraft for pay and status as they will have a door to this via the flow.



If Compass were allowed to operate as an affiliate without a contract, the operations would be under terms and conditions that were established by either Northwest or Compass. It would take years to negotiate a first contract. In recent cases, it has taken as long as three years. This contract would be comprised of mostly the terms and conditions the company established, with some minor improvements.



Historically, it takes the second contract, or a later contract, to gain any true, large-scale improvements. It simply could not be allowed to have an affiliate that NWA pilots could potentially fly at, which operated with nothing more than company-established terms and conditions. The fact that we are negotiating a contract and not merely allowing Compass to implement ‚€œterms and conditions‚€Ě of employment for an unknown number of years is a head start. The Compass pilots, inclusive of our own furloughed, will have an industry-standard first contract and it will be enforced.



CONTRACT COMPARISON

(This chart is a comparison between Compass and the carriers that operate similar aircraft)


Compass
ASA
PSA
Mesa
Mesaba
Eagle
Republic
Horizon
Comair

Days Off
Line Holder 11

Reserves 11

(4) inviolate


10



10


10



10


10



8


11



11


10



10


12



11


13

35 day bid period

12


11



11

1 set of (3) and 1 set of (4) immovable days

Reserve

Call out
2 hours
75 minutes
Not Specific
60-90 minutes
1-1.5 hrs
2 hrs
90 minutes
90 minutes
90 minutes

Dead Head
75%

Pay and Credit
100%
Paid 1 for 2; if duty period contains deadhead only
50%
Paid 1 for 2; if duty period contains deadhead only
75%
75%
100%
75% pay

100% credit

FLOW
Up/Down
No
No
No
No
Yes
No
No
No

Per Diem
$1.55
$1.50
$1.35
$1.15
$1.55
$1.65
$1.60
$1.75
$1.55

Retirement

(401k)
YOS MATCH



1-4 3%

5-8 4%

9+ 5%


1 1.2%

2 1.8%

3 2.4%

4 3.0%

7+ 4.5%




1-4 2.5%

5-6 4%

7-9 6.5%

10+9.5%


2%


1-5 25% to 6%



6-10

50% to 8%



11-15

75% to 9%



16-19

100% to 10%



20+

125% to 10%


1-4 50% to 7%



5-9 75% to 7%



10-14 80% to 8%



15-19 87.5% to 8%



20 + 8%


1-6 2.5%

7-13 4%

14+ 6%


100% of first

10%


1-9 2%

10+ 3%



2011 and beyond



1-5 2.5%

5-10 4%

10-15 6%

15+ 7%

Min Duty Credit
3:30
None
N.S.
Reserve

3.9 hrs
4:00
3:36
4:00 Reserve
4:00
4:20 Avg.

Monthly Guarantee
Line Holder

75

Reserve

75




75



75




75



72




70



70




75



75




72



75




75



75
(5 week bid period)



92



86.3




75



75

Holiday Pay
Additional 4 hrs
None
None
150%
None
None
Additional 4 hrs
None
None

Vacation
3.00/day
2.65/day
3.00/day
3.00/day
2.86/day
3.75/day
4.00/day (PDO)
3.9/day
2.86/day














FACTS AND RUMORS

Rumor: A furloughed pilot returning to Northwest and subsequently furloughed would not be able to flow to Compass.

Fact: False. That pilot would have flow rights to Compass.



Rumor: No Northwest pilots are interested in Compass.

Fact: False. Many Northwest pilots have opted for Compass jobs, with most of them deferring a commitment to a class date. As we discussed, the rate of recalls to Northwest is greater than expected. Fortunately, the flow was bargained to last in perpetuity. If in the future there are furloughs, those pilots will have an option to flow to Compass.



Rumor: If a furloughed pilot elects Compass, he will receive no D.C. money upon his return to Northwest.

Fact: False. He will be eligible for D.C. contributions on the same basis as other Northwest pilots. The amount has not yet been finalized.



Rumor: Now that Northwest has acquired Mesaba, they no longer need Compass.

Fact: False. Northwest is going full speed ahead with Compass.



Sincerely,

Compass Negotiating Sub Committee

Ron Barnett

Ron Hay

###
crewdawg52 is offline  
Old 05-07-2007, 11:39 AM   #17  
Banned
Thread Starter
 
Joined APC: Jan 2007
Posts: 48
Default

Just got the turned down letter in the mail to day I guess things always happen for the better I just don't see that yet.
АЕРОФЛОТ 214 is offline  
Old 05-07-2007, 11:39 AM   #18  
Chief Jeppesen Updater
 
FlyerJosh's Avatar
 
Joined APC: Oct 2005
Position: Executive Transport Driver
Posts: 3,047
Default

Sorry to hear that...
FlyerJosh is offline  
Old 05-07-2007, 12:09 PM   #19  
Reserve for Life
 
Jetrecruiter's Avatar
 
Joined APC: Nov 2006
Position: Right Seat for life
Posts: 221
Default Here we go again.

Quote:
Originally Posted by HotMamaPilot View Post
are compass pilots gonna be union? or scabs?
What is the meaning of a scabs?.....I don't believe that NW pilot's or Mesaba have been on strike. Lets use our choice of words correctly. With that said...Compass will be ALPA.
Jetrecruiter is offline  
Old 05-07-2007, 04:43 PM   #20  
Gets Weekends Off
 
Ftrooppilot's Avatar
 
Joined APC: Nov 2006
Position: Body at sea level; heart at 70,000+
Posts: 1,032
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by crewdawg52 View Post
. . . . .The growth of Compass, or any other affiliate that flies aircraft which seat 51 to 76 passengers, is limited after the initial 90 aircraft are acquired based on growth at mainline NWA. Of the 90 total aircraft, up to 36 can be operated by Mesaba Airlines to replace the original 36 AVROs. This can be done without any NWA furloughed pilots having rights to that flying. Through negotiations, three categories of feeder carrier flying were established. Category 1 is Compass. All current and future furloughed NWA pilots have rights to 100 percent of these jobs. Category 2 refers to a carrier that operates the 51- to 76‚ÄĎseat aircraft while NWA finances those aircraft. NWA furloughed pilots are entitled to half of the captain and half of the first officer positions that those aircraft create. . . . ###
If I understand this correctly, furloughed NWA pilots are not entitled to half of Captain and FO Mesaba CRJ9 positions until Mesaba gets a 37th CRJ9. ie: 1 new aircraft, 5 Captains and 5 FOs would result in furloughed NWA pilots picking up 5 pilot positions ????
Ftrooppilot is offline  
 
 
 

 
Post Reply
 



Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search


Related Topics
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Cape Air Interview pilot754 Regional 79 06-25-2013 07:31 PM
Up comining Compass interview АЕРОФЛОТ 214 Regional 9 04-24-2007 05:21 AM
2nd interview? dacm313 Regional 0 10-18-2006 07:02 PM
Compass off the ground? joel payne Regional 28 10-06-2006 10:00 PM
Northwest Pushes To Unveil Subsidiary 'Compass' In June fireman0174 Major 14 03-30-2006 04:02 AM


All times are GMT -8. The time now is 06:30 AM.