Alright,
This is a little off the subjec of the thread but the logging as refered to earlier would be legal, even if it wasn't moral. However Hog is right as well, anybody that puts their application in to an airline through AirlineApps.com is splitting their times up as dual and pic and instructor seperately. As for how many airlines that add or don't add the times together, that I don't know.

XtremeF150

 

I know logging it as both PIC and dual recieved is LEGAL, that wasn't what I was saying. Way back when the way it was explained to me was that you didn't do yourself any favors logging both PIC and dual recieved for training flights because some places split it up anyway (apparently Mesa? and I can't believe I forgot about airlineapps. It was a pain getting my times to add up with some flights logged as both PIC and dual). And as I started instructing I followed that pattern and have been doing it that way for 2+ years now. Have I done my students a diservice? I don't think so.

 

Mesa doesn't care. I vaguely remember that airline apps does ask for that breakdown, but no airline has published PIC mins that exclude dual-received PIC

Bottom Line: The FAA specifically allows you to use dual-received PIC towards the ATP experience requirements, so why the h*ll not??? Haven't you paid enough for your flight training already???

BTW I'm the LAST person who would ever advocate a shortcut of any kind, but this is just plain silliness.

 

As far as I can recall,there are few airlines that have specific PIC requirements to get an interview. Yes, they want a break down of PIC time when you fill out the paperwork, but at that point is doesn't matter anyway. Don't get me wrong, I don't have anything against someone who logs their dual-recieved as PIC. Its just that all of my dual-recieved is seperate from PIC (except a few places where an instructor filled it out as both when I went to an FBO for a checkout) and I don't feel like I was cheated out of anything. Most of the instructors I know keep it seperate. If a student asked me to log it as both I would have no problem doing it.

I guess the way I see it, just because the FAA says I can, doesn't mean I should. The FAA also specifically says I can not have flown in the clouds for 5 months and 29 days and then go up in hard IFR with an airplane full of my friends and family. Doesn't make it a good idea.

 

Anytime the applicant has less then 1000 hours it's guranteed that they are from a fast-track academy. As far as Mesa PD, I don't get it. Pay 45K for training plus housing and comm. college costs just to have a chance to be hired at an airline where you can get hired easily if you just had your 1500 hours, you don't even need college. I would understand if Skywest had a program like this, but MESA? Shows that they are really after the money.

 

Well, it is in fact true. I am that person. I went through the Mesa Pilot Development program. Although very inexperienced, I have learned a valuable lesson already- be wary of whiny snively pilots with terrible attitudes, of which there seem to be many on this forum. Life is what you make of it, and it seems many people have let their attitudes make their lives miserable, despite flying airplanes for a living. And in addition, I have plenty going for me. While some of the whiners here whine, I will be working hard to learn, maintain a positive attitude while of course avoiding losers whose only joy seems to be attempting to bring others down.

Have a wonderful day, everyone. I know I will!

 

Rick:
With regards to the PIC, the way the application is set up, the post-rating dual given can't be entered as PIC time. The way I actually log it, I have about 200 PIC. But the times won't jive if you try and enter it that way on their app.

 

Sorry for so many replies to this thread, but the last sentence above really cracks me up. Just who the hell ISN'T after the money? This is one of the things that amazes me about complainers. And what precisely is wrong with going after the money? And who's to say how any individual should pursue their career. Frankly, being a CFI doesn't make sense to me, as I am not a teacher by nature. However, I certainly don't think it is my place to judge others who choose that route.

I wish everyone here the best in their career. The best thing many here could do is change their attitude. But frankly, the whiny and snively vibe here just isn't for me.

Carry on, as you were, and all that other stuff.

 

Not taking sides, but well spoken my friend. All the best.

 

"Although very inexperienced, I have learned a valuable lesson already- be wary of whiny snively pilots with terrible attitudes, of which there seem to be many on this forum"

So does the fact that I don't believe 300 hour pilots belong in an RJ make me a whiny snively pilot? Or can I have an honest opinion that differs from yours and not be whiny?