|
Gentlemen,
Before this thread gets out of hand and we have an internet based pistols at dawn type situation on our hands, I'd like to say a few things. First off, I'm not oblivious to the fact that there are 000's of American citizens, formerly employed by various airlines in the US that are currently out of work. Without wanting to patronize anyone, they have my sincerest sympathy. I've been furloughed and it's a $hitty thing to have to face, especially when there are pretty much no options out there. I'm one of those foreigners that a few of you seem to think should frog-marched out of the country because I have a Green Card and work as an airline pilot. There are those that seem to think that you can simply front up at the border and be allowed in, with all the rights that come with being a permanent resident. This just isn't the case. To work for any 121 carrier in the US you have to be either a US citizen or a permanent resident with a Green Card. Having been through the process of becoming a Green Card holder, I can tell you they don't hand them out like candy. You must either be married to a US citizen or have family members that are US citizens. The former will take 2 years for an application to be processed and the latter is currently around 8 years for processing. So it's neither quick nor easy. If you then choose to be become a US citizen, it can be as quick as 2 years and as long as 5 years AFTER you get your Green Card. If an American were to marry a citizen of the EU, they would be afforded exactly the same rights as I have here, with regards to living and working. Absolutely no difference. The only difference would be the amount of time and effort involved to get an JAA license, compared to an FAA license. But let’s face it, should the FAA ever adopt a JAA style ATP system, half the people currently flying wouldn't probably be able to. Simply because it requires far too much effort, time and money. When you hear a foreign pilot on the radio, exactly how do you know they're not a US citizen? Just because you have a US passport doesn't mean your accent changes overnight. |
Originally Posted by rickair7777
(Post 579547)
Paying taxes is not the reason they are allowed to work here. They have the right to live and work here because government policy allows it...don't get too caught up in that, it can be changed.
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Originally Posted by Kenny
(Post 579565)
Gentlemen,
Before this thread gets out of hand and we have an internet based pistols at dawn type situation on our hands, I'd like to say a few things. First off, I'm not oblivious to the fact that there are 000's of American citizens, formerly employed by various airlines in the US that are currently out of work. Without wanting to patronize anyone, they have my sincerest sympathy. I've been furloughed and it's a $hitty thing to have to face, especially when there are pretty much no options out there. I'm one of those foreigners that a few of you seem to think should frog-marched out of the country because I have a Green Card and work as an airline pilot. There are those that seem to think that you can simply front up at the border and be allowed in, with all the rights that come with being a permanent resident. This just isn't the case. To work for any 121 carrier in the US you have to be either a US citizen or a permanent resident with a Green Card. Having been through the process of becoming a Green Card holder, I can tell you they don't hand them out like candy. You must either be married to a US citizen or have family members that are US citizens. The former will take 2 years for an application to be processed and the latter is currently around 8 years for processing. So it's neither quick nor easy. If you then choose to be become a US citizen, it can be as quick as 2 years and as long as 5 years AFTER you get your Green Card. If an American were to marry a citizen of the EU, they would be afforded exactly the same rights as I have here, with regards to living and working. Absolutely no difference. The only difference would be the amount of time and effort involved to get an JAA license, compared to an FAA license. But let’s face it, should the FAA ever adopt a JAA style ATP system, half the people currently flying wouldn't probably be able to. Simply because it requires far too much effort, time and money. When you hear a foreign pilot on the radio, exactly how do you know they're not a US citizen? Just because you have a US passport doesn't mean your accent changes overnight. |
Welll now......I guess that pretty much sums up the whole citizenship debate.
Back to the origional thread.......Anyone on here, preferably a CA or FO for AC, know how the QOL is?:D |
Originally Posted by rickair7777
(Post 579549)
Ultimately my issue here is why can't I get a pilot job at Lufthansa, AF, or BA? Until that is answered, I have no sympathy for greencard holders. Stop spewing crap about rights and laws in the US when the EU will not reciprocate.
It's entirely possible for you to get a job at BA or at AF and LH for that matter: (If you speak German or French). When I was first here in the US about 10 years ago, an English friend of mine came over, to oversee the setting up of a US division of the company she was working for. She started dating an American friend of mine that I was instructing with and ended up marrying him. They decided to try their luck back in the UK and after working for easyjet, he now works for BA. Full Texan drawl and all! |
Originally Posted by rickair7777
(Post 579408)
See my previous post...citizens of most asian and middle-eastern countries can come here and get work, so it is reciprocal. EU is where there is an opportunity imbalance.
Pilots form the EU all have FAA ratings and a right to work/live in the United States. If you merry an English girl and do an JAA conversion, you can work in the EU too!
Originally Posted by rickair7777
(Post 579549)
Ultimately my issue here is why can't I get a pilot job at Lufthansa, AF, or BA? Until that is answered, I have no sympathy for greencard holders. Stop spewing crap about rights and laws in the US when the EU will not reciprocate.
|
Originally Posted by ERJFO
(Post 579591)
Pilots form the EU all have FAA ratings and a right to work/live in the United States. If you merry an English girl and do an JAA conversion, you can work in the EU too!
The EU will and does reciprocate. You can get residency, convert your ratings, and then apply... |
Well, I'm lucky that I hold both an American and a Canadian citizenship. I applied because of this thread. Man I'm glad I spent all that time and money on the Canadian ATPL conversion.
|
Originally Posted by Kenny
(Post 579565)
Gentlemen,
Before this thread gets out of hand and we have an internet based pistols at dawn type situation on our hands, I'd like to say a few things. First off, I'm not oblivious to the fact that there are 000's of American citizens, formerly employed by various airlines in the US that are currently out of work. Without wanting to patronize anyone, they have my sincerest sympathy. I've been furloughed and it's a $hitty thing to have to face, especially when there are pretty much no options out there. I'm one of those foreigners that a few of you seem to think should frog-marched out of the country because I have a Green Card and work as an airline pilot. There are those that seem to think that you can simply front up at the border and be allowed in, with all the rights that come with being a permanent resident. This just isn't the case. To work for any 121 carrier in the US you have to be either a US citizen or a permanent resident with a Green Card. Having been through the process of becoming a Green Card holder, I can tell you they don't hand them out like candy. You must either be married to a US citizen or have family members that are US citizens. The former will take 2 years for an application to be processed and the latter is currently around 8 years for processing. So it's neither quick nor easy. If you then choose to be become a US citizen, it can be as quick as 2 years and as long as 5 years AFTER you get your Green Card. If an American were to marry a citizen of the EU, they would be afforded exactly the same rights as I have here, with regards to living and working. Absolutely no difference. The only difference would be the amount of time and effort involved to get an JAA license, compared to an FAA license. But let’s face it, should the FAA ever adopt a JAA style ATP system, half the people currently flying wouldn't probably be able to. Simply because it requires far too much effort, time and money. When you hear a foreign pilot on the radio, exactly how do you know they're not a US citizen? Just because you have a US passport doesn't mean your accent changes overnight. Well said Kenny..... |
Originally Posted by rickair7777
(Post 579549)
Nobody said anything about accents (I speak four languages, three of which are european in origin).
Nothing wrong with dual citizenship either Ultimately my issue here is why can't I get a pilot job at Lufthansa, AF, or BA? Until that is answered, I have no sympathy for greencard holders. Stop spewing crap about rights and laws in the US when the EU will not reciprocate. Oh.... not everyone can take the oath just because they want to. I still need to spend some time towards that 5 years before I can take oath, no matter how badly I want to do it |
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