Would ToiletDuck support using the Bankruptcy court to set aside parts of Frontier's CBA? After all they're bought and paid for right? Part of the reason they were in bankruptcy was that they paid too much money for good salary and work rules, eh? I mean, hell if they had RAH's payrates they could be the ones buying airlines now.

I hope this is a wake up call to Mainline airlines -- mainline airlines are hemmhoraging money but regionals can be raking it in. Are those 2 points connected? Does outsourcing* REALLY save that much money?

* Commuter airlines are different, but how many of those still exist?

[quote=powrful1;634028]I think the "most fair" integration would be where everyone is unhappy. Of course this will probably drag on for years, probably what the company wants, who knows, good luck everyone! Mod Turb at all levels![/qu

THERE IS NO OTHER WAY
DOH:cool:

I hear you 80. What's to stop RAH from using the A320's on the old Delta Shuttle routes that they now fly? After all Midwest has a nice get out of scope free card with Delta and thus I think it's brand is VERY important to Bedford.

The coming months will be telling. Does Delta continue it's very one-sided code-share with Midwest? Do they expand it? Does LM continue to ask his constituents for more scope relief?

I work at RAH. I think you should keep your seat, base, and position. For a time. Eventually, via a fence, RAH pilots should be able to bid that. It's only fair. I'm sure you read the letter from your union stating that, you either accept what happens with integration, or maybe not have a job at all. I believe they also said that without this rescue from BK, that you would be unemployed. Just step back and think. I know you want everything to stay the same for yourself, but you gotta give up something if your being saved from not having a job at all. Like I said before, I think it would work best for everyone if there were a fence involved for a set amount of time, but not very long. You must remember that our contract protects us and you of this happens from us being whipsawed against eachother. We have to work together as one pilot group to make this work.

How would you feel if Southwest was buying you out of BK? Would you still want your rate, base, and equip? I'd rather them aquire you than deal with all the grief and bull this is going to cause. I don't care if I ever fly a bus here. I'd rather it be at mainline. I don't think I'll have that chance though, so I'd like the chance to bid for it, since my company aquited them. It just seems fair to me. But, I'm sure evryone will continue to share thier opinion just like I did. I'm just trying to be objective, rather than spread hate like many on this board.

Flex,

I'd want nothing more than to have you and all F9 pilots retain their seat, base, and pay. I have no idea how an integration would take place or even what would be fair. Personally, I kinda hope southwest comes in and outbids us and you all end up over there with a DEN base while retaining their seat.

As another RAH pilot I can say that reading our in-house boards, Chance speaks from a VERY small minority. Most seem to agree that a % integration, DL/NW style is the way to go, with a timed fence. I'd say there's a 0% chance of a flush-bid where guys get displaced out of base/equipment.

Most of us agree that in this scenario everyone wins. Guys at the purchased entities keep their base/seat/pay, and we get enhanced pay for our equipment and the chance to bid to better things in the future.

I don't hear any of the rational voices calling for the ability to bid guys out of their seats/bases.

The only sticking point I see is what to do about furloughs. I do hear many make the argument that those on furlough be stapled below ours on furlough. If you have no base/equipment currently, some say our guys should get their jobs back first, since its our money that's funded all this. I tend to agree with that, but don't expect that F9 or MW guys would.

You've spent months bashing Bedford and now you're sticking to every word. Regardless of what he says there's one thing that is concrete and that's our language on RAH acquiring other airlines. Any cert. purchased goes on our seniority list. Regardless of whatever funds you have and lawyers sitting there it's plain as day in the RAH contract that you will be on one seniority list. The only way around this is for BB to sell the newly acquired lists. One way or another both Frontier and Midwest can expect to join the RAH seniority list.

If you'd like to know what I think you could simply ask. Would I support using BK to set aside parts of F9's CBA? I don't want to see any paycuts anywhere. Why would you assume otherwise? When have I ever mentioned anything stating such? All I've said is that these two airlines were about to put everyone on the street. That's been altered because they are now purchased by RAH. I don't expect my QOL to go down because of this. If it does that negates the reasons for having a union in the first place. I'm sorry but I expect our union to look after it's own first just like I expect F9's to look after them. There's no "here's a little gratuity" this is life. Just like XJT hen SKYW was putting a bid on them they fought tooth and nail for what they were entitled to based on their previously negotiated contract. It's no different here. Airlines have folded left and right over this pass year and it's sad but I still expect our contract to be followed. The second you allow and exception it all goes down the drain.

On a side note F9 pays less than CAL, JUBL, SWA, etc on equal size equipment. I'm not trying to be hard headed about this but there's no reason RAH pilots should be put behind F9 or midwest guys automatically. Completely my opinion but doesnt seem right. We have guys on the street and since they've been paying dues since day one they deserve to come back here first. I don't think a TWA style of setup is bad at all and I think they'd be lucky to get it. Take notice I used words like ME and I before any armchair QB's start trying to say I'm speaking on everyone else.

Already, the cries of " WE BOUGHT YOU " are raising their ugly heads. Shades of Fedex/Tiger, Allegheny/Piedmont, North Central/Hughes Air West/Southern/Republic/Northwest

I feel like I'm in the movie, Ground Hog Day