Ya, and real mainline pilots are furloughed because your real "FOs" fly large jets (sorry, you can not call an 70-90 seater an RJ) for pennies on the dollar.

I guess they are stealing jobs from my counterparts? Food for thought...

AAflyer

 

Not sure why you would think I would disagree with you... but regionals flying what should be mainline aircraft is another topic right?

 

Just busting your chops, stuff like what your talking about used to **** me off, now it is just more crap that has made this business so ugly, and I seem to have become immune...

Hope you are or enjoyed your instructing. I still do some on the side.

Cheers,

AA

 

Get a grip AA. I don't know a single regional pilot that wouldn't rather fly a 70-90 seat jet on a mainline seniority list....for mainline pay. Unfortunately, the MAINLINE pilots let that cat out of the bag a long time ago. How about instead of you *****ing about losing job, you lead a charge to reign that scope back where it belongs. No mainline pilot has any farther to look, than in the mirror when another mainline pilot is furloughed.

In fact, you could work with regional pilots instead of turning your nose up at them. Or, do you think you're too good for that?

IMO, If it's a mainline paint livery on the aircraft....it should be mainline pilots operating the flight. What are YOU doing to make that happen???

 

Reread my second post....

As for what am I doing. Making SCOPE the number one priority of this contract. If it means burning the place down to prevent a fleet of E170s-190s at Eagle then so be it.

That is what I, and we are doing...

But don't worry, if it comes down to that I am sure thousands of pilots would line up to fly a 80 for 80.....

AA

And stop with this mainline let the cat out of bag bulll**** anymore. Half the companies that are watching theiir company's flying farmed out had their contract and SCOPE gutted in BK. By the way how is it the Midwest airlines pilots and possibly Frontier pilots fault now? Management has and will continue to come up with creative ways to outsource flying, and as long as pilots continue to fly it for pathetic wages it will continue.

SO WHAT HAVE YOU DONE?

 

First people were calling it an "internship" and now "probationary" period. You can paint a pig a different color, but its still a pig. The point being your paying to use your cert in the right seat of a 121 operator. Simply put, your paying for job. And around and around we go about PFT/PFJ

And by the way the $29G number is from GIA's website not some number that magically is made up. I do give those interns/probationary peeps over there at GIA for having some balls. They've got pics of their faces on the website in the class photos section! No shame in their game.

 

I think I understand AA's point. It seems ironic that current or wannabe RJ FO's rain fire on Gulfstream, when the existence of the RJ's themselves leads to the diminishment of pay at the mainline level, and ultimately, for all pilots.

In other words, you spew anti-PFJ venom and castigate Gulfstream for ruining the industry, when Gulfstream has what, 150 total pilots? The regional airlines and the pilots who fly them allow airlines to shift flying to the low bidders.

It seems that the "holier than thou" and cliche anti-Gulfstream and anti-PFJ comments on this website might be better directed at the very RJ FO's spewing this stuff.

 

Part of the problem is that this industry is sold to people as a cash cow - "Gee golly and aww shucks you'll be a rich man by the time you've got 5 years in at the regionals - and don't forget the prestige and glory - and the unlimited international travel - and the FAs that will knock on your door in the middle of the night and want you to rub lotion on their backs. Yes, you'll have a wonderful life in the high dollar world of aviation."

So if you were fed that line of crap you would be very likely to plunk down your $29,000 buckaroos to get a shot at that lifestyle. What I don't get is how many people believe it. I'm not saying that GIA intentionally misrepresents the lifestyle - the fact is a lot of people do. And a lot of people still believe the hype. They don't get to see the reserve couch and the ramen noodles and the tiny little paycheck.

All they know is they spent tens of thousands of dollars on getting this job that doesn't pay enough to cover the rent. Now what? Of course they're going to fly a Super Jumbo Embraer 90 Passenger Whisperjet! How could you back out now? You've got bills to pay and ends to meet, that $14.50 an hour sure beats nothing, right?

So its not these places that are causing problems with farming out flying to cheaper and cheaper labor - it's the blatant misrepresentation of this industry to potential pilots!!! I still know people that think they're going to get rich being a regional FO, even after I show them my paycheck. Or they think they're going to move up to the majors after a few years at the regionals.

So they think that by investing this money or by working for peanuts they are going to make a lot of money. They just have to slog through the crap for a few years to get to the glory at the end. If only they could see the truth.

If the industry was seen for what it was and prospects were given a reality check into what our lives and futures are we could put an end to all this arguing about scope and whipsawing and undercutting and PFT/PFJ and everything else. Our industry has been sold for too long as an easy way to earn wealth quickly. People look at this industry like a get-rich-quick scheme.
They'll do anything to get their foot in the door...anything.

 

I understand your point. But I find it very unlikely that someone would borrow tens of thousands of dollars to go to Gulfstream (or get the money from mom and dad), without knowing dim prospects for riches. Unlike years before, Gulfstream program grads don't even get to become Gulfstream FO's after the program because Gulfstream has furloughed pilots. They pay their $30,000.00, get their, what, 300 hours, and then go home. That cannot be a mystery to anybody.

If these guys choose to do it, why is it anybody else's business? Now, here come the "because it destroys the industry!!!" arguments, which ring hollow.

 

my dady's paid for it! sorry u couldn't afford it!
just kidding!