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Why they do that? a Q&A with NY approach.


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Why they do that? a Q&A with NY approach.

Old 11-25-2010, 08:18 AM
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Default Why they do that? a Q&A with NY approach.

Due to the number of PM's with questions that my other thread generated, I feel this would be a good opportunity to give any pilots interested in the "why they do that? about any of the local procedures involving NY Approach.

Although my area of expertise is the EWR sector, feel free to ask anything involving any of our other areas (if I don't know the answer I'll grab one of my colleagues from the pertinent areas to get the answer).
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Old 11-25-2010, 11:13 AM
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We have all heard of "penalty" vectors.

Is this an urban legend or if a pilot is excessively rude or demeaning or demanding or non compliant or all of the above will a pilot be denied something just because you are sick of them or given an off route vector or slowed down or the like?

I would imagine no in your airspace just since there is no where to put them but ive heard some real winners on the radio before and always wondered if ATC has a way to retaliate.

Of course you would NEVER do this but have you heard of this ever being done before?
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Old 11-25-2010, 11:16 AM
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Why when we call for a pushback and have already coordinated with clearance due delays consistently pop up on the taxi out to any destination ? We're all trying to save fuel and these delays are too often and lack any planning or safeguards...
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Old 11-25-2010, 12:07 PM
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So for direct or higher we should ask for "Ajax"?
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Old 11-25-2010, 12:17 PM
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Why instead of more ground delays or in flight speed restrictions, when we get to within 20 miles of EWR, approach have us zig zag for about 30 minutes for spacing before we can actually set up for the final approach, even in perfect weather.
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Old 11-25-2010, 12:53 PM
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Is it true that under "normal" weather type days, like low winds, due to EWR's runway configuration, they pretty much determine what arrival/departure flow of both LGA and JFK?

Also, does LGA have the smallest chunk of airspace for the approach controllers to work with? I know, it's the "smallest" of the NY airports. But the 2 years I was based there, it was still pretty busy. Especially before the March 01 "slottery".
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Old 11-25-2010, 02:30 PM
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Any chance you know someone from CLT who can come on here and answer some questions?
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Old 11-25-2010, 02:33 PM
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Originally Posted by usmc-sgt
We have all heard of "penalty" vectors.

Is this an urban legend or if a pilot is excessively rude or demeaning or demanding or non compliant or all of the above will a pilot be denied something just because you are sick of them or given an off route vector or slowed down or the like?

I would imagine no in your airspace just since there is no where to put them but ive heard some real winners on the radio before and always wondered if ATC has a way to retaliate.

Of course you would NEVER do this but have you heard of this ever being done before?
Yes, it does happen. if you get under a controller's skin there are many ways to "retaliate", although its not something that happens all the time. You really have to **** somebody off big time in order for them to do something like that.

We have very "subbtle" ways of changing the sequence. Also..denying any shortcuts, or extending a downwind are others. Again, not something that happens too often.
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Old 11-25-2010, 02:34 PM
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Originally Posted by gijoe411
So for direct or higher we should ask for "Ajax"?
This is my online name, and nobody would recognize it there except....me.
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Old 11-25-2010, 02:37 PM
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Originally Posted by JetPipeOverht
Why when we call for a pushback and have already coordinated with clearance due delays consistently pop up on the taxi out to any destination ? We're all trying to save fuel and these delays are too often and lack any planning or safeguards...
There are too many variables with this. WX at your destination, or on any segment in between can cause delays to pop up. Also traffic volume may increase in a particular area that affects your proposed route, and they may put up a temporary ground stop for that area. This is very hard to predict exactly.
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