You're wrong. TSA, Mesa and many many other unionized regionals make less. We could go around and around on this, an I'm happy to help. A union in and of itself does not get you paid more. But the issue is really, how do you increase pay and rules? I say, in the long run you stand a better chance of higher earned income by working with your company to ensure success and growth. Union or no union.

 

This whole situation with Skywest buying out Horizon's CRJ's and opening bases in the PNW is really crappy. In fact, that AAG was willing to farm out this flying to Skywest is the main reason I left Horizon. For all my friends on the Q4 in PDX and SEA, I hope only the best for them and their families.

However, to say that this was the result of pitting one pilot group against another simply isn't true. Horizon may have at one point in time had good pay, but that's no longer the case. The only reason the QX pilot group currently has higher AVERAGE pay rates is because of the relatively high longevity of it's pilot group. Most of the captains I flew with at QX had been there for 20+ years. A CR7/CR9 captain at SKYW doesn't make much less than a CR7 CA at QX after 15+ years. When was the last contractual pay raise at QX? If I remember correctly, 2007. And the new contract that the Teamsters negotiated for the pilot group reduced min guarantee (which the union tried to argue as an increase in scheduling flexibility, but at the end of the day leaves you with less $$$ in your pocket) AND left them with pay arbitration. Needless to say, I don't think the union helped much in negotiations. Pay rates at Skywest have increased steadily over the years with Cost of Living Indices, and were recently given a new pay package that I'm pretty sure was not "thanks to" QX's pay rates. The fact of the matter is that Skywest is the largest operator of CRJ's in the U.S., and can operate the jets at a lower total cost due to averaging fixed costs over a large fleet (Economies of Scale...as most posts on this thread have mentioned)

My guess is that this will likely only be a temporary solution until Alaska figures out who they want to fly jets in the 90 - 110 seat market...Mainline, QX, SKYW, or ________ ...This will likely replace the CR7 lift contract between AS and SKYW, IMHO

 

.

HAL,

You left QX? I thought you loved it here? I thought I was just being a Debbie Downer about QX and should cheer up? What gives? Someone finally see the light?

I guess hypocrisy has now been deemed hip.

 

Pigg! Great to read your shining nuggets of happiness again. Even more, I'm glad to see that you haven't reduced yourself to personal attacks on a public forum.

Yep, you got me! Guess I should have articulated my point more clearly. If you have a problem with your employer, either do something about it or quit, don't just sit around complaining like a debbie downer. Yea, I did quit...and believe it or not, it was a very hard decision, so thanks for calling me a hypocrite. Believe me, I would rather be living at home, making twice as much as I do with my new employer, and playing xbox while I sit on reserve. That would be way more fun and much easier. But, I know that if I stayed that course, it would only hurt my career in the long run.

AAG farming out the CRJ flying to Skywest, and GJ making it clear that the Air Group had no intention to order more Q400's for a while was the straw that broke the camel's back. As we all saw, things changed from bad to good to bad pretty quickly. I did love working at QX...the only thing I didn't like about it was flying with people who hated their job, made it painfully obvious, and yet were nothing more than just talk. Sound familiar?

Anyways...enough thread drift...back to the topic at hand

 

BTW, very nice work man...I mean you went all the way back to reference one of my posts from 6 months ago just to slam me on APC? That must've taken a good chunk of time! Plus, it means your thinking about me...what can I say, I'm a little flattered

 

Hal,

Well at least you finally listened to me.

If you recall the original post was pertaining to potential new hires. I was telling them that QX was not a good place to come in terms of their long term career goals. I see that you have come to the same conclusion. I was trying to deal in reality of the situation. I did not see the future of QX as rosy as you did. I see that you have finally come around, I am proud of you, that is growth.

I am trying as hard as I can to get out of QX as well, wish me luck!

No hard feelings, we all make mistakes.

 

Haha, yea I guess. I know you'd love to hear me say "I left QX because of Pigg's advice"...let's just say it was more that the squealing became annoying

Ultimately, though, I definitely see your point. QX isn't career suicide if that's where you want to retire. In fact, it would be ideal if your ambition is just to fly in the PNW, make $50 - 80k / year, and retire in a turboprop. Since I turn 65 in 2049, that would be 42 years at Horizon if I stayed there.....no thanks. I figured flowing up to AS was within reach, but I did the math...15 new jets = 160 new hires, 30% of which are guaranteed from QX, which is 48 pilots. I'm sure all the 6 - 10 year FO's are gunnin for those slots, and I'd just end up getting the shaft. Long story short, I get what you're saying. Guess my hope didn't fit into AAG's reality.

Good luck on the job search! Hopefully you'll find a gig that better fits your life! Now if OPEC will quit being a bunch of speculating @$$h0le$, we can get some hiring going on