I have read HR 5900 several times and just reviewed it again. To my reading the only FO requirement is an ATP. However, the rumor going around is that the FAA is going to require an ATP and a Type Rating for all 121 FO's?

It seems like regionals are all handling differently from providing an ATP & Type at the PC (regardless of if the FO already has an ATP) and some are giving only a PC if the FO already has an ATP.

I hear the Teamsters (and other groups will be shortly) are recommending FO's get their ATP's on their own to insure compliance, but if the Type is required, this would seem futile.

Is anyone else hearing similar concerns/contradicting rumors?

 

9E is doing an ATP/Type during the PC and initial programs now. It's a "normal" PC with a few added things (steep turns, zero flap land, taxi from left seat). Only "difference" is a few hours to practice the day prior and no TTP (train to proficiency) on the ride.

 

At XJT the type and ATP certification are being done through the normal CQ AQP with a few modifications. I can't speak for what other regionals are doing but I think most are doing something similar.

 

Your airline has a training dept with people who are in charge of this stuff. The training department has a direct link to the FAA via the POI, and they have agreed on how to tailor the training curriculum to comply with the law.

These people are paid to do this stuff. They've spent many hours organizing it.

Yet, you "heard" something and may be making the decision to go spend a couple thousand bucks based on what somebody told you on the internet, instead of official company information.

 

Sounds like great marketing to me. Kudos to that guy.

 

At PDT, for FO's we are given one extra day of training in the sim. During this training we do the steep turns and stalls signed off. Then we complete the normal recurrent training. Since we follow AQP, it's the normal three days of CQ. First day is all ground work followed by 2 days of 1/2 sim 1/2 ground. During the first sim we do a Maneuver's Evaluation (MV) where we do all the single engine approach/fires, circling, and all the other fun stuff where they try to kill you. Since, as an FO, it's part of your ATP ride the FO does most of the flying. We are told we are allowed 2 repeats, either 1 maneuver twice or 2 maneuvers once. If you complete a maneuver unsatisfactorily you are told right away. No waiting till the end to hear. The second day we do a LOFT scenario. I just went through it and honestly, the standards are the same as normal recurrent. Overall it was fairly easy.

The only catch is you are issued a full ATP and type but the type has a limitation stating you cannot operate as PIC until successful completion of 25 hrs of IOE. We had an SIC type before and so I don't really see how this is much different...

And I heard all the same rumors about PDT but after going through it, I'd recommend against it. You won't see a return on your investment. Also remember, regionals are hurting for pilots now anyways, they are not going to do anything to jeopardize losing a qualified crew member. They need you to succeed.

 

If you regional operates your aircraft outside the US, then both pilots already need a type. Many airlines already issue an SIC type based on a PC to meet this ICAO requirement...when it first became an issue I got mine after-the-fact based on my last recurrent PC, just filled out an 8710.

If your FO's suddenly need a type maybe it has more to do with destinations?

 

The new proposed requirement is for a PIC type rating. I'm at a carrier that gives SIC types in initial and I had my ATP prior to coming here. But I'll be taking a PIC type ride during my next AQP cycle.

 

The requirement for a the SIC to hold a type rating isn't in HR 5900, it's in the NPRM. Along with the requirement to have 50 hours in class to get an ATP, 24 hours of ground school and 16 hours of sim, and the whole restricted ATP idea.

 

http://www.google.com/url?sa=t&sourc...baVFXqIOx0C0LA

HR5900 was the law signed by Congress so everything in there is a certainty. What I posted above was the NPRM, which is only proposed. It mentioned all FOs having a type rating, which I take to mean PIC type. Word is that more progress on this NPRM won't come out til next year. A lot of airlines are preparing for the most restrictive language and giving FOs a PIC type.