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Airline Pilot Central Forums (https://www.airlinepilotforums.com/)
-   Regional (https://www.airlinepilotforums.com/regional/)
-   -   Delta to Pinnacle: Concessions or shutdown (https://www.airlinepilotforums.com/regional/71424-delta-pinnacle-concessions-shutdown.html)

Mesabah 12-05-2012 01:12 PM
Originally Posted by 80ktsClamp (Post 1305614)
Actually, I showed you were 100% wrong.
0% of my above post was not true?

80ktsClamp 12-05-2012 01:14 PM
Originally Posted by Mesabah (Post 1305620)
0% of my above post was not true?
As far as the NW relationship and what happened during times of furlough as compared to DL, yep. (I was there)

Mesabah 12-05-2012 01:18 PM
Originally Posted by 80ktsClamp (Post 1305621)
As far as the NW relationship and what happened during times of furlough as compared to DL, yep. (I was there)
What was your DOH at 9E?

80ktsClamp 12-05-2012 01:30 PM
Originally Posted by Mesabah (Post 1305624)
What was your DOH at 9E?
2003... I was about the same seniority as most of the NW furloughees.

dc10guy 12-05-2012 01:32 PM
Originally Posted by Mesabah (Post 1305611)
Yes, most of the furloughs had no interest in going back to the regionals. However, my post relates to Johnso29's comments about how mainline pilots can't control what happens at the regionals, but based on history, especially at NWA, that is not true.
I know most had no interest going to an regional. I was one from NWA. I was just questioning your statement about flow backs to XJ back when NWA furloughed. I believe the flow was not happening at the time. It was signed along time after 9/11. I don't remember any flow back ever happening to XJ actually.

80ktsClamp 12-05-2012 01:35 PM
Originally Posted by dc10guy (Post 1305637)
I know most had no interest going to an regional. I was one from NWA. I was just questioning your statement about flow backs to XJ back when NWA furloughed. I believe the flow was not happening at the time. It was signed along time after 9/11. I don't remember any flow back ever happening to XJ actually.
Correct, there were no flowbacks to XJ.... that was around 2007-8 timeframe when that was signed.

Mesabah 12-05-2012 01:43 PM
Originally Posted by dc10guy (Post 1305637)
I know most had no interest going to an regional. I was one from NWA. I was just questioning your statement about flow backs to XJ back when NWA furloughed. I believe the flow was not happening at the time. It was signed along time after 9/11. I don't remember any flow back ever happening to XJ actually.
I never said there were flowbacks to XJ when NWA furloughed in 2001, there were a few guys who came in as management street LCA's here, that was it. I was a manager in tech ops at NWA during those years, we were afraid that the discord going on between the DAL pilots and its regionals was going to spill over into NWA and it never did. Later on during the 2005-2006 bankruptcy era after management rejected the NSTAR proposal, ALPA was able to force management at NWA to agree to exclusivity on representation of its regionals.

johnso29 12-05-2012 01:45 PM
Originally Posted by Mesabah (Post 1305154)
Actually, there was quite a different relationship between 9E/XJ/CZ with NWA, than DAL had with its regionals. NWA pilots were given jobs at the regionals if they wanted them. The check airman that trained me on the CRJ was a NWA furlough. We had flow backs at XJ, and Compass could have been flushed completely had NWA furloughed. I can tell you that Delta has been a very different animal to deal with since the merger between DAL/NWA. We had a much stronger relationship with mainline pilots than we do now.
Originally Posted by Mesabah (Post 1305611)
Yes, most of the furloughs had no interest in going back to the regionals. However, my post relates to Johnso29's comments about how mainline pilots can't control what happens at the regionals, but based on history, especially at NWA, that is not true.
Apples to oranges. NWA pilots never controlled which airplanes went to non wholly owned regional carriers. They didn't control the block hour rates, or duration of CPA's. They didn't control when planes were parked, or the lease rates on them.

Pinnacle's BK was not caused by Delta pilots. Pinnacle filed for BK before Delta pilots current contract was even a proposed TA. Comair's announced fleet reduction was before 9E's BK.

dc10guy 12-05-2012 01:47 PM
Originally Posted by Mesabah (Post 1305154)
Actually, there was quite a different relationship between 9E/XJ/CZ with NWA, than DAL had with its regionals. NWA pilots were given jobs at the regionals if they wanted them. The check airman that trained me on the CRJ was a NWA furlough. We had flow backs at XJ, and Compass could have been flushed completely had NWA furloughed. I can tell you that Delta has been a very different animal to deal with since the merger between DAL/NWA. We had a much stronger relationship with mainline pilots than we do now.
I was answering you quote about flow backs in this statement.

Mesabah 12-05-2012 01:54 PM
Originally Posted by johnso29 (Post 1305648)
Apples to oranges. NWA pilots never controlled which airplanes went to non wholly owned regional carriers. They didn't control the block hour rates, or duration of CPA's. They didn't control when planes were parked, or the lease rates on them.

Pinnacle's BK was not caused by Delta pilots. Pinnacle filed for BK before Delta pilots current contract was even a proposed TA. Comair's announced fleet reduction was before 9E's BK.
Did I say Delta pilots caused the Pinnacle bankruptcy? Colgan bankrupted 9E.


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