Delta to Pinnacle: Concessions or shutdown
 

Negotiating Committee Update

Management advised the Negotiating Committee that it has received new information from Delta concerning our future fleet plan. If we are able to come to terms on a Restructuring Agreement that amends the JCBA, it is anticipated that the 200 fleet will begin to shrink sometime next year, and that we may be in position to gain additional CRJ-900 aircraft. If we are unable to reach agreement on revisions to the JCBA, we have been told that Pinnacle will wind down, and that our flying will be taken over by other carriers who have already been selected by Delta.

In order to assess the impact of these forecast revisions to the fleet plan, both the ALPA and management negotiating teams have decided to work internally for the next several days. We are currently planning to return to the bargaining table next week.

We do not believe that the projected fleet plan changes mean that there is no future for Pinnacle, but we do believe that it is highly likely that Pinnacle will experience a reduction in its overall fleet size. This is important information for you to have, especially as some of you consider the wisdom of bidding on a Long Term Leave or consider what other employment options might be available to you.

The Negotiating Committee is in close contact with the MEC, and continues to work on formulating proposals that address the needs of the company and the needs of our pilots in an uncertain environment.

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I love the choice of words they used. 200 WILL shrink. 900 MIGHT come IF we reach TA

So, game over?

I might blow pink unicorns and mermaids holding winning powerball tickets out my rear.

Dare I say? Not saying, but want to say. Should I say?

Burn it down!

Don't say it dude... its bad enough.

The negotiating committe must be close to a deal if we are getting vote yes propaganda.

would it be the name of an airline that some mods will not allow us to say because it will get the thread closed in 2 pages?:confused:

Exactly what I was thinking.

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Dear Delta,

Tell us something we didn't already know!

~The Pinnacle Pilot Group

Gojet smells blood.

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The GoJet guys are having a party today!!

"Pinnacle". The Comair sequel.

(Taking concessions never got Comair a single additional aircraft. In spite of what MAY have been promised. Good Luck.)

"You may receive additional -900 growth...."

All the while we're presently losing -900 airframes ahead of schedule.


HMMMMMmmmmm.

Exactly. You will take concessions and no additional flying will come your way. Take a good look at Comair history folks and play accordingly. Get your apps in everything you can think of, but, please try to stay away from [insert infamous bottom feeder airline here].
Good luck guys - you're going to need it.
And don't forget to give your fellow "brothers" at DALPA credit for the shifting of ALPA jobs to the non-union crap ones. I like to give credit where it's due.

Maybe they want to get rid of some 200's at Skywest quicker? It's not like those airplanes are going there without Delta getting anything in return. My guess, we'll get a new contract and we lose a bunch of 200's and gain some 900's.

My guess is 9E could get 35 -900's and drop 90-100 200's. If you play ball.... Still a loss but.....

If the proposed concessions are agreed to, it will cripple the standard for compensation at the regionals. Do you really think it's worth that to gain 35 or so airplanes? It will drive down pay everywhere.

Plus why would Delta just take all their 900s away just to give them some back?

The commuters that have the Lowest labor costs and can agree to contracts that greatly benefit the majors will be around for a while

The commuters that don't agree to concessions but instead choose to offer their pilots a "pilot career", with decent pay and benefits won't be able to survive.

Truly a race to the bottom

So you don't think Skywest will make it? They just got awarded a bunch more 76 seaters in addition to a contract with AA.

They will make it for a few years. And then their turn will come to take pay cuts.

But how many 50 seaters will be taken out of the system as the 76 seaters come online?

How long will it take to wind us down?

Quick question................whats a "commuter"????

Is that what you want to talk about, my definition of commuter?

Exactly! I know it's tough guys. I lived through the Comair mess. Don't make our mistakes, if margins are so tight that concessions make the difference between sink or swim, the company's problems are larger than that and can't be saved anyway. Don't give in; full pay till the last day!

Well somebody just had to say it, didn't they?

Inb4 the lock.

What exactly should DALPA and Delta pilots have done to prevent this unfortunate situation? Should they have attempted to negotiate a guarantee of Pinnacle's everlasting viability? :confused:

I'm not aware of any contract in which mainline pilots have negotiated a say in who is chosen to do the outsourced flying. That would be ridiculous.

You're like the slow clap guy, just had to do it and then look around for the followers while you clap like an idiot. :D

9e filed BK, & Delta provided DIP financing. Delta pilots and DALPA don't control where Delta management shifts their flying in the RJ shuffle game. That's not an option for us. I suppose it's American pilots fault for Eagle losing flying, or United pilots fault for TSA pilots losing flying. Obviously, we all control that.

the Delta (ALPA) pilots voted to take the RJ200 fleet to 125 and conceed scope for more large RJ's to the lowest bidder, 9E (ALPA) has 140... 140-125 = 15 planes...probably more

Either way the DALPA guys have to look out for themselves...not pointing the finger, but facts are facts

Compass was an example, the NWA bankruptcy contract stipulated that the 76 seat flying was going to be done by ALPA pilots. You at mainline have a say in your flying, it is your flying we are doing, they have done a good job in making you think it isn't.

I would have been ecstatic to get rid of every last outsourced RJ (or bring them over to mainline) if we could have.

In a very indirect word play your statment could be somewhat vaguely accurate. Nonetheless, that is not what Delta pilots voted for regarding scope.

You need to also thank us, your ALPA brothers, for allowing our mainline jobs to be transferred to substandard airlines like Pinnacle, while mainline pilots got furloughed.

None of Pinnacle's flying is really Pinnacle's. All that flying is DAL/NWA mainline, never forget it. You are sitting where you are sitting because mainline jobs got transferred to your low bidding, "pay for training/Gulfstream hiring" airline. THat is it.<---It should have never been this way. Now the young have a taste for blood. And all of a sudden PCL is a high paying airline while GOJet is not :) News FLash: Both airlines are a piece of turd in terms of pay and rules.

I am all for the Pinnacle dudes getting on at Delta but stop with your arrogant drivel. We are all in this mess together.

TEN

PS. We all get fortunate and lucky. We should all help each other out. Pilot groups are not the enemy. We need to work with each other.

Show me in the Delta pilots contract where it states "we conceed more large RJs to the lowest bidder". Better yet, tell me what pilot group has control over which regional is awarded flying. With your logic, it's APA's fault that Eagle lost flying to Skywest and it's UAL pilots fault that TSA lost flying to GoJet. Your argument doesn't hold water.

Gee thanks, but us 'commuter' guys have been screaming for years to have the majors tighten up scope.

Seriously, take the flying back. Tighten scope!

Whoa whoa whoa...what did you think was going to happen? Anyone who has done their homework over the last several years knows that the company with the lowest cost margin gets the airplanes. Where have the aircraft gone? To the Lowest bidders...where were the jobs lost...Comair and soon 9E (ALPA carriers) because of high costs. Just because it's not written in fine print on a contract doesn't mean it won't happen. Why not start a flow and give mainline guys an oppurtunity to have a place if crap hits the fan like CZ has? Keep ALPA pilots flying. It's business 101. Why give 76 airplanes to 9E or OH operating with 15+ year payscales when you can operate the same aircraft with guys at CZ and G7 at 5-6 year pay. As I mentioned before I don't blame any pilot group for the choices they make, and I don't blame a single pilot for a yes or no vote, because in reality a pilot makes a decision usually based on what's best for him and if he has one, his family. I'm all for mainline taking back flying...it is your flying. Period. My conceed statement was just saying that giving up larger airframes, because in reality, Delta has 76 seat payscales. Why not fly 76 aircraft there? Trust me I know it was a net loss in Regional seat feed...it will bump mainline flying in between 60-65% in the not so distant future...that's a good thing