Airline Pilot Central Forums - Pinnacle is done; let's bow out with dignity.

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- - Pinnacle is done; let's bow out with dignity. (https://www.airlinepilotforums.com/regional/71431-pinnacle-done-lets-bow-out-dignity.html)

Quote:

Originally Posted by Phuz (Post 1302124)

Some people might be of the opinion that its all a farce and you'll still be flying whether you give concessions or not.

Also, shouldn't concessions (if necessary) go both ways? Where's the outcry for Delta to pay more revenue to 9e?

Why should delta pay more? It is all about the bottom line. The flying will always go to the cheapest bidder. 9e and every other regional are just contract carriers. You do not own any flying or routes. It is not just in aviation.

Quote:

Originally Posted by dc10guy (Post 1302177)

Why should delta pay more? It is all about the bottom line. The flying will always go to the cheapest bidder. 9e and every other regional are just contract carriers. You do not own any flying or routes. It is not just in aviation.

Maybe we need a paradigm change? What happened to management's words "We fixed it" that was offered to the families of the Buffalo crash?

Quote:

Originally Posted by FlyJSH (Post 1302160)

We are on the Titanic. We have two choices: scream like frightened children, pleading to G@d for help and fighting our way to a life boat; or we can go down like men, giving our life vests to others.

Many of us have worked to improve working conditions and pay. We did... perhaps only a bit, but we did. To those who work at other respectable companies, I humbly ask that you tip your hat to us as we draw the line. We chose the wrong battle, but hopefully, our efforts, and those of our brethren will eventually win the war.

Honorable pay for honorable work. No concessions.

I, for one, choose honor.

This.

Highest respect...

Quote:

Originally Posted by atrdriver (Post 1302210)

This.

Highest respect...

I respect his opinion, but I expect the Pinnacle pilots to agree to the concessions. Even the Comair pilots offered one last concession a few months ago to try and stay in business. Luckily the company rejected their offer.

Quote:

Originally Posted by ShyGuy (Post 1302043)

The lifers are saying either pay your mortgage or stand on your principles. What happened to "99%" and "for a demonstration in unity, keep dragging your feet?" Now it's everyone for themselves, screw the industry, it's okay to make 77/HR as a 18th yr RJ captain and 35/HR as a 4+ yr FO? At some point, this job isn't worth it. Burn it down. Hold the line or you will screw the profession for the other regional airlines today and in the future.

Quote:

Originally Posted by hockeypilot44 (Post 1302104)

Here's how it will happen. History almost always repeats itself. The Pinnacle pilots will sign a concessionary TA. Pinnacle will shrink. Pinnacle will eventually dissolve. Signing the TA will keep Pinnacle in business for 5-10 years. Standing your ground will end Pinnacle in 1-2 years. Again, the Pinnacle pilots are not going to stand their ground. There are pilots at Pinnacle that never will upgrade. There are captains at Pinnacle that will be downgraded and never upgrade again.

Comair, a group of airline pilots that held a 2 month strike, started giving concessions when threatened like Pinnacle is being threatened. Hell, Pinnacle is full of Gulfstream PFTers. The Comair pilots even tried to offer another concessionary TA a few months ago when they realized the end was near. The Pinnacle pilots will accept a concessionary TA of some sorts. The first offer might be turned down, but a concessionary TA will pass.

Don't cave to pressure from the lifers (TW) to take concessions, and "save the airline". It didn't work for Comair, and it isn't going to work for you. They have clearly stated that all of your -200s are going away. That leaves -900s for the super senior. If you take cuts, 60-80% of your pilots get furloughed, 50% of the remaining get downgraded, the airline survives another 3-5 years, meanwhile for you 60-80%, your next airline hammers you to take pay cuts because "we can't compete with that Pinnacle contract". The majority of you are losing your jobs no matter what. Don't shoot yourself in the foor on the way out the door. No concessions!

^ this! People need to understand we're already screwed, giving concessions won't help, it just a bonus for DL management. I am a FO, I have bills, rent, car payment and do not live in my parents basement. I will be voting no because I would rather leave with my dignity intact.

If you don't work at Pinnacle, please don't offer them an opinion on what they "should" do. We are not in their shoes and it's not up to anyone else to say!

Quote:

Originally Posted by sigep_nm (Post 1302118)

My fellow 9e pilots,
Five years down the road will anyone remember the 2400 Pinnacle pilots and their final stand against the industry?

ding ding ding.....all the tough guys from other airlines that are quick with the 'Burn it down" slogans will be the first to sign a concessionary contract at their airline when the cycle repeats in 3 years if pinnacle does hold the line and shuts down. They will see holding the line didn't do any good, even with Pinnacle shut down they are still being asked for concessions, and they will start the "feed my family" argument. And the cycle will continue as long as there is more than 1 regional airline. The older this industry gets the more it has become about me me me and a swordfight to see who has the biggest wiener on the internet, nothing about pride.

Quote:

Originally Posted by DENpilot (Post 1301830)

That's a scab like mentality if I ever saw one...

ahh I just love it when guys that are still green to the industry throw around the scab word whenever a pay or QOL issue pops up. Especially against a pilot group that went from being on the lower end of the scale to the upper end because they didn't take managements final offer during 5 years of negotiations :rolleyes:

Quote:

Originally Posted by Truman_Sparks (Post 1302286)

If you don't work at Pinnacle, please don't offer them an opinion on what they "should" do. We are not in their shoes and it's not up to anyone else to say!

Yep, it's easy for someone who work at another airline to tell us how to vote. I personally will look at the TA (if we get one) and vote what I think it's best for my family and I. You wouldn't see me go tell a Delta guy how to vote on their last TA, and I would expect the same.