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-   -   New AA Regional Aircraft Order (https://www.airlinepilotforums.com/regional/75788-new-aa-regional-aircraft-order.html)

spuzzyair 07-04-2013 05:04 PM

I am going to guess it would be the ERJ175... I bet they can come up with some agreement with Embraer to return 145's for 175's... but that also doesn't necessarily mean that Eagle will operate them. Republic has problems staffing its already scheduled Eagle flying so that would leave Skywest and Compass.

FlyingKat 07-04-2013 06:27 PM


Originally Posted by ShyGuy (Post 1439410)
A wholly owned Delta carrier will not be operating for another mainline carrier. That has never happened when Delta owns the regional. As long as Delta owns Endeavor, it will be DCI only.

Uhhh wrong answer. While owned by Mother Delta Comair bid on flying for other carriers and Comair/Regional Elite permformed underwing services for other carriers. Presently DGS performs underwing for other carriers.

spuzzyair 07-04-2013 06:35 PM


Originally Posted by FlyingKat (Post 1439468)
Uhhh wrong answer. While owned by Mother Delta Comair bid on flying for other carriers and Comair/Regional Elite permformed underwing services for other carriers. Presently DGS performs underwing for other carriers.

Ground handling and operating are two different animals.

While Comair did bid on other flying, it never materialized. However, I do not seen 9E operating for anyone other than Delta. They need to get their own house in order, and better their performance before they even begin to think of shifting their focus to operating for someone else.

FlyingKat 07-04-2013 06:40 PM


Originally Posted by ShyGuy (Post 1439432)
Consider past history with Pinnacle and Delta. Delta cut the payment due to Pinnacle because they didn't want to pay for the United side of things. While Delta may contract below wing services to other airlines, I don't think you'll see Endeavor fly as AA/UA or any other airline's regional.

The big issue with Pinnacle was due to the new contract and integration of Mesaba. Delta agreed to pay the costs of training pilots created by this integration. However Delta balked when they discovered this included training pilots to staff United flying. Further Trenary underbid both the United and original Pinnacle 900 flying. Both operations were marginal at best and were ditched in bankruptcy. The decision to get rid of the United flying was an economical decision (just like the Delta Pinnacle 900 flying) and had nothing to do with Delta's interest in keeping Pinnacle from flying for anybody else.

I think you will see Endeavor Air do anything that makes operational and economic sense and increases the value of the company to make it more attractive to investors when the time comes for Delta to sell it off.

Hijack now over.....

ShyGuy 07-04-2013 06:57 PM

Yes, over and under wing services. Delta won't allow a wholly owned airline to fly as a regional for another legacy. Most nearly all wholly owned regionals fly only for their own legacy mothership and no one else. Eagle, PSA, Piedmont, Endeavor, etc

ShyGuy 07-04-2013 06:59 PM

Who is gonna want to buy a regional when the model is broke and dying industry wide? Good licking getting new ATP rated pilots to show up for 23 grand a year. You'd be an idiot to buy a regional. It's no longer worth it. FFD profit contracts are all going away. The regional will have to deal with the bulk of all it's expenses.

meyers9163 07-04-2013 07:21 PM

Parker isn't buying planes for a non wholly own to fly. He's a pay to play CEO. AE is my guess. Get a bunch of 145s gone for 175s or 900s.

Doubt it's any other regional but a wholly owned based on Parkers history. Hell look at RAH. AA isn't buying 175s for them. Just my guess but AE is my guess.

FlyingKat 07-04-2013 07:23 PM


Originally Posted by ShyGuy (Post 1439483)
Yes, over and under wing services. Delta won't allow a wholly owned airline to fly as a regional for another legacy. Most nearly all wholly owned regionals fly only for their own legacy mothership and no one else. Eagle, PSA, Piedmont, Endeavor, etc

Shy this same Delta management team allowed Comair (while it was wholly owned by Delta) to bid on RFPs for other airlines while they were owned by Delta. I don't know how to make it any plainer than that for you. Eagle at one time operated codeshares for Northwest on the west coast. If it makes money, they'll do it.

FlyingKat 07-04-2013 07:30 PM


Originally Posted by ShyGuy (Post 1439485)
Who is gonna want to buy a regional when the model is broke and dying industry wide? Good licking getting new ATP rated pilots to show up for 23 grand a year. You'd be an idiot to buy a regional. It's no longer worth it. FFD profit contracts are all going away. The regional will have to deal with the bulk of all it's expenses.

You can say the same thing for the entire industry but people still invest in it and buy companies. FFD makes the mainlines more money than revenue sharing. That is why the entire industry went FFD in the late 90s. Any industry analyst worth his salt will tell you there is going to be lot of consolidation of companies and certificates over the next five years.

DL31082 07-04-2013 07:48 PM


Originally Posted by FlyingKat (Post 1439475)
The big issue with Pinnacle was due to the new contract and integration of Mesaba. Delta agreed to pay the costs of training pilots created by this integration. However Delta balked when they discovered this included training pilots to staff United flying. Further Trenary underbid both the United and original Pinnacle 900 flying. Both operations were marginal at best and were ditched in bankruptcy. The decision to get rid of the United flying was an economical decision (just like the Delta Pinnacle 900 flying) and had nothing to do with Delta's interest in keeping Pinnacle from flying for anybody else.

I think you will see Endeavor Air do anything that makes operational and economic sense and increases the value of the company to make it more attractive to investors when the time comes for Delta to sell it off.

Hijack now over.....

What's not stated in this argument was United was renegotiating the Q400 contract to make it profitable. Delta's DIP financing demands, and they were demands stated they had to exit the United flying. Without that the contract would have been renegotiated and the would probably still be flying at Pinnacle.


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