Unions?
12-13-2015 | 01:21 PM
#11
Gets Weekends Off
Joined: Nov 2013
Posts: 120
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Of course he hasn't. Do you really need to ask?
Perhaps it should be required reading prior to accepting membership.
At my first carrier the hard copies were distributed to us new-hires. The implication was it was done because it was important to educate yourself on the union you were joining. Reading it enlightens the new members on industry background, the importance of a union, and the most important one; an individual's duty as a member of the union.
That lost sense of individual responsibility is why questions like this are even asked.
I don't blame the original poster, it's a collective failure.
Perhaps it should be required reading prior to accepting membership.
At my first carrier the hard copies were distributed to us new-hires. The implication was it was done because it was important to educate yourself on the union you were joining. Reading it enlightens the new members on industry background, the importance of a union, and the most important one; an individual's duty as a member of the union.
That lost sense of individual responsibility is why questions like this are even asked.
I don't blame the original poster, it's a collective failure.
12-13-2015 | 01:30 PM
#12
Living the Dream
Joined: Sep 2013
Posts: 1,795
Likes: 0
How does Flying the Line address the failures of ALPA at the regional level? I, II, and Hard Landing were all published prior to the sale of scope.
That being said, if the books do address why ALPA never brought all airline pilots under the same umbrella contract or to a minimum standard, could somebody paraphrase rather than telling the OP to go read some books?
And for the record, OP, your questions were perfectly reasonable and I'd love to know too.
That being said, if the books do address why ALPA never brought all airline pilots under the same umbrella contract or to a minimum standard, could somebody paraphrase rather than telling the OP to go read some books?
And for the record, OP, your questions were perfectly reasonable and I'd love to know too.
12-13-2015 | 01:35 PM
#13
Line Holder
Joined: Oct 2012
Posts: 251
Likes: 0
From: e145 fo
This might give light to the moisture behind my ears but.. What's the point of having such a large Union like ALPA if every airline has different contracts with their pilots, paying different rates, and compete with each other (resulting in lower pay rates)? So for example, shouldn't all ALPA members be operating under a single contract? Same pay for flying a given airframe, same rigs, days off etc.
I feel like operating this way would have prevented the mainline/regional pay and benefits inequality that exists today, and especially combat the way regionals are used against each other by their owners (the reason I think American feels the need to own 3 regionals to fly its passengers....). Heck I'd even say with a proper Union (of ALPA's size anyway) the regionals wouldn't exist at all. But this is my first Union job and I'm not savvy to how exactly these big unions are supposed to work. Thoughts?
Forgive me if this is a dead horse, and I do realize the other important things that ALPA and other unions offer. Just thinking out loud..
I feel like operating this way would have prevented the mainline/regional pay and benefits inequality that exists today, and especially combat the way regionals are used against each other by their owners (the reason I think American feels the need to own 3 regionals to fly its passengers....). Heck I'd even say with a proper Union (of ALPA's size anyway) the regionals wouldn't exist at all. But this is my first Union job and I'm not savvy to how exactly these big unions are supposed to work. Thoughts?
Forgive me if this is a dead horse, and I do realize the other important things that ALPA and other unions offer. Just thinking out loud..
12-13-2015 | 01:51 PM
#14
Gets Weekends Off
Joined: Nov 2010
Posts: 451
Likes: 0
From: 737 Cap
How does Flying the Line address the failures of ALPA at the regional level? I, II, and Hard Landing were all published prior to the sale of scope.
That being said, if the books do address why ALPA never brought all airline pilots under the same umbrella contract or to a minimum standard, could somebody paraphrase rather than telling the OP to go read some books?
And for the record, OP, your questions were perfectly reasonable and I'd love to know too.
That being said, if the books do address why ALPA never brought all airline pilots under the same umbrella contract or to a minimum standard, could somebody paraphrase rather than telling the OP to go read some books?
And for the record, OP, your questions were perfectly reasonable and I'd love to know too.
To somehow expect that joining ALPA will fundamentally transform a pilot group is pretty silly. What you've bought is resources. Each pilot group elects their representatives and uses their resources and situation to create leverage. There has rarely been a more pilot friendly leverage environment in the history of this industry.
Scott
12-13-2015 | 01:52 PM
#15
Gets Weekends Off
Joined: Nov 2012
Posts: 880
Likes: 0
From: 737 FO
One large problem, all these people complain about ALPA this and ALPA that. Let me ask you a question, have you gotten involved with ALPA and tried to better your profession? Most people just act like Monday morning quarterbacks in response to what goes on. If you think you'd be better off without ALPA, please, by all means, go for it. The grass is not always greener.
12-13-2015 | 02:41 PM
#17
Banned
Joined: Oct 2014
Posts: 2,137
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Alpa is what keeps regional pilots in line. It's the company's police department to ensure pilot compliance with whatever scheme the regional airline devises. It is fully accepted and sanctioned by major airlines and their pilots. For them to enrichen themselves, you must suffer.
Most pilots are too dumb to see this therefore it persists like a deadly cancer.
You know you are screwed when alpa puts on presentations such as "Fee For Departure Interview Tips" instead of "Let's Destroy the Regional Airline B Scale Once and For All".
Most pilots are too dumb to see this therefore it persists like a deadly cancer.
You know you are screwed when alpa puts on presentations such as "Fee For Departure Interview Tips" instead of "Let's Destroy the Regional Airline B Scale Once and For All".
12-13-2015 | 02:45 PM
#18
Gets Weekends Off
Joined: Nov 2010
Posts: 451
Likes: 0
From: 737 Cap
Scott
12-13-2015 | 03:06 PM
#19
Gets Weekends Off
Joined: Jun 2008
Posts: 2,941
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I'm going to say your first name is Scott and your last name is Stoops.
12-13-2015 | 03:29 PM
#20
Line Holder
Joined: Feb 2014
Posts: 76
Likes: 0
From: 75 FO
Keep in mind here, ALPA is NOT a union. It is an ASSOCIATION designed to allow any regional to be whipsawed against each other without national intervention. ALPA just wants numbers so they can increase they're income.
If you don't believe me, give Tim Cannoll a call and ask him whether they're a union or not. PSA is a prime example of why ALPA is NOT a union and not on the side of regionals.
If you don't believe me, give Tim Cannoll a call and ask him whether they're a union or not. PSA is a prime example of why ALPA is NOT a union and not on the side of regionals.
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