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Old 03-09-2013, 07:01 AM   #1  
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Default Why Eagle guys should not be mad at Republic

I have been a long time observer on this website but finally decided to post.

I have been analyzing and listening to some of the objections from Eagle guys about AA regional feed going to Republic and Skywest. As I pondered over AA decisions to give flying to these other companies I started focusing on what my long term career goals are. I think that most of the Eagle guys, like me, want to have a better quality of life in the long term. The easiest way to get that is to get on a seniority list at a legacy carrier since that is where the better work rules and pay are. I am willing to bet that at least 75% of the Eagle guys do not want to make American Eagle their career but use it as a stepping stone.

So, when I started to think about my long term goals and the state of the industry I started to get excited that some of the Eagle flying is going to Republic and Skywest. I realize that my comments might make some pilots very mad, but let's analyze the situation. Right now Eagle is struggling to hire people. They started the incentive program and from what I am hearing they are getting only about 10 new hires per month. I don't think they will be able to hire the 600 they plan this year. Now, we have the numbered guys that are going over, not all, but at least 150 of them. Then, some will jump ship and go to other legacies or majors. The point I am trying to make here is that Eagle will get short on pilots very soon. If somehow ALPA wins the lawsuit to fly the new 175s, then Eagle will need to find at least 500 extra pilots to do the extra flying. This will further expand the lack of pilots problem at Eagle.

As you guys already know, the company must keep 95% of the pilot group because of a clause in the TA we just ratified. This provision becomes active as the merger is complete. At the same time, the 824 must go to AA at a rate of 50% of the new hire classes, and at 60% if there is one furlough. So, if we keep loosing flying to Republic and Skywest, there will be a pilot surplus at Eagle instead of a shortage. The company does not want to pay the pilots for doing nothing, that is for sure, and the flow through program will work nicely. However, If we do get the new, shiny, tin cans then we will be in a pilot shortage situation and the company can withhold pilots from going over to AA for "operational considerations". Now it will be the same scenario as is 2000. Other people get new hire slots while Eagle guys sit and watch. The flow through program will be useless.

So, as we reconsider our long term goals, I would state that it will be more beneficial for the Eagle pilots if flying went to Republic and Eagle shrunk a little. More pilots will go over to AA and they will be better off in the long term. The new jets will not improve the quality of life of eagle pilots because the rate of pay is the same and with a lack of pilots they will work us harder with less days off.

Basically, what I am saying is that we take advantage of this flow through agreement and get guys on that AA seniority list as soon as possible and as many as possible. We will not do that if we keep getting flying that we can't cover. I say, let Republic and Skywest do the regional flying, let them grow, who cares, as long as Eagle guys go over. The only way to get the Eagle guys over to AA at the greatest rate is to create a surplus of pilots in house so that the company wants to send them over and not withhold anyone for "operational considerations."

ALPA is going to court over this Republic award, but if they win it will actually destroy the career potential of eagle pilots. ALPA will effectively reduce the flow of pilots to AA, while Eagle pilots will get to push fancy new buttons at the same pay and with low quality of life.

I must state that I am not waiting for the flow through but it may be my way to a legacy carrier if the other two do not call, so I want to improve my chances of getting there as soon as possible.
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Old 03-09-2013, 07:10 AM   #2  
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Yawn. Already a thread
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Old 03-09-2013, 07:18 AM   #3  
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where? I must have missed it.
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Old 03-09-2013, 07:20 AM   #4  
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DoNotReset View Post
I have been a long time observer on this website but finally decided to post.

I have been analyzing and listening to some of the objections from Eagle guys about AA regional feed going to Republic and Skywest. As I pondered over AA decisions to give flying to these other companies I started focusing on what my long term career goals are. I think that most of the Eagle guys, like me, want to have a better quality of life in the long term. The easiest way to get that is to get on a seniority list at a legacy carrier since that is where the better work rules and pay are. I am willing to bet that at least 75% of the Eagle guys do not want to make American Eagle their career but use it as a stepping stone.

So, when I started to think about my long term goals and the state of the industry I started to get excited that some of the Eagle flying is going to Republic and Skywest. I realize that my comments might make some pilots very mad, but let's analyze the situation. Right now Eagle is struggling to hire people. They started the incentive program and from what I am hearing they are getting only about 10 new hires per month. I don't think they will be able to hire the 600 they plan this year. Now, we have the numbered guys that are going over, not all, but at least 150 of them. Then, some will jump ship and go to other legacies or majors. The point I am trying to make here is that Eagle will get short on pilots very soon. If somehow ALPA wins the lawsuit to fly the new 175s, then Eagle will need to find at least 500 extra pilots to do the extra flying. This will further expand the lack of pilots problem at Eagle.

As you guys already know, the company must keep 95% of the pilot group because of a clause in the TA we just ratified. This provision becomes active as the merger is complete. At the same time, the 824 must go to AA at a rate of 50% of the new hire classes, and at 60% if there is one furlough. So, if we keep loosing flying to Republic and Skywest, there will be a pilot surplus at Eagle instead of a shortage. The company does not want to pay the pilots for doing nothing, that is for sure, and the flow through program will work nicely. However, If we do get the new, shiny, tin cans then we will be in a pilot shortage situation and the company can withhold pilots from going over to AA for "operational considerations". Now it will be the same scenario as is 2000. Other people get new hire slots while Eagle guys sit and watch. The flow through program will be useless.

So, as we reconsider our long term goals, I would state that it will be more beneficial for the Eagle pilots if flying went to Republic and Eagle shrunk a little. More pilots will go over to AA and they will be better off in the long term. The new jets will not improve the quality of life of eagle pilots because the rate of pay is the same and with a lack of pilots they will work us harder with less days off.

Basically, what I am saying is that we take advantage of this flow through agreement and get guys on that AA seniority list as soon as possible and as many as possible. We will not do that if we keep getting flying that we can't cover. I say, let Republic and Skywest do the regional flying, let them grow, who cares, as long as Eagle guys go over. The only way to get the Eagle guys over to AA at the greatest rate is to create a surplus of pilots in house so that the company wants to send them over and not withhold anyone for "operational considerations."

ALPA is going to court over this Republic award, but if they win it will actually destroy the career potential of eagle pilots. ALPA will effectively reduce the flow of pilots to AA, while Eagle pilots will get to push fancy new buttons at the same pay and with low quality of life.

I must state that I am not waiting for the flow through but it may be my way to a legacy carrier if the other two do not call, so I want to improve my chances of getting there as soon as possible.
There is a lack of applicant for the Regionals, it doesn't matter who does the flying AMR will meter the 824 to the minimum. Lets say that the large RJ come to Eagle instead of RAH then the applicants will come to Eagle as well. People are following the airplanes, if they give airplanes to Expressjet then people will go there. People are following the shortest upgrades and career progression. It doesn't matter who gets the AA airplanes you will see the minimum amount of people flow as AMR knows that the pool is drying for people willing to work for peanuts.
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Old 03-09-2013, 07:24 AM   #5  
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I wonder what routes the 175 will fly . Cause when I flew the 700 it felt like mainline flying . Can't be good for mainline having 175s fly
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Old 03-09-2013, 07:38 AM   #6  
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The painful reality is that collectively Eagle pilots can not be angry at other carriers for claiming their flying. The primary reason is that they themselves allowed it by failing to police their union leadership who is mired in malfeasance and is arguably corrupt. This leadership gave away the very scope that would have prevented this transaction and others and still to this day years later, the same out of control leadership continues unchallenged.

Tragic and sad, but what more can you really say ?
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Old 03-09-2013, 07:47 AM   #7  
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The painful reality is that collectively Eagle pilots can not be angry at other carriers for claiming their flying. The primary reason is that they themselves allowed it by failing to police their union leadership who is mired in malfeasance and is arguably corrupt. This leadership gave away the very scope that would have prevented this transaction and others and still to this day years later, the same out of control leadership continues unchallenged.

Tragic and sad, but what more can you really say ?
Well said. That just about covers it. Thread over. Egl pilots stop being so butt hurt over it. It happens
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Old 03-09-2013, 08:06 AM   #8  
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As I understand it; the majority is replacement flying, not new flying.

RAH can't staff their existing flying. Good luck staffing this. At least the cancelation penalties will be paid outside of AAG

Eagle is already covering ExpressJet AA flights cancelled for lack of crews
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Old 03-09-2013, 08:07 AM   #9  
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I wonder what routes the 175 will fly . Cause when I flew the 700 it felt like mainline flying . Can't be good for mainline having 175s fly
Can't be good for mainline? It isn't good for mainline that the CRJ 700 (65 seats) are flying these routes already. Why do people make such a big deal about an E-175 (76 seats). It's still an RJ the size of a DC-9 replacing mainline flying. There is no difference between the CRJ 900 and E175, they both are seating 76 and flying what mainline used to fly but it seems people are OK with the CRJ but not the Ejet.
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Old 03-09-2013, 08:10 AM   #10  
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Originally Posted by Mason32 View Post
As I understand it; the majority is replacement flying, not new flying.

RAH can't staff their existing flying. Good luck staffing this. At least the cancelation penalties will be paid outside of AAG

Eagle is already covering ExpressJet AA flights cancelled for lack of crews
But this is exactly what management wants, whipsaw and obtain the lowest cost and when one carrier can't staff it have another one pick up the slack!
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