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Old 04-29-2017, 05:11 PM   #1  
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Default Non crew in the flightdeck

I fly for a management company on a specific airplane that does 91/135.... i was asked by the owner to please get out of my seat and let a fellow of his to sit in the seat ( right seat) I told him no way thatveas going to happen and he said w"whaat do you mean? I have done this before and we are 91" i told him " its still not going to happen" he went to his seat quite upset ( i dont care). Its been reported to management..a d they take stuff like this seriously ..waiting to see what they are going to do about it on monday..anybody have something like this ever happen to them ?
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Old 04-29-2017, 05:32 PM   #2  
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In 91 it might have been legal. Crew are not required to physically occupy their control station at all times and I don't recall anything in 91 prohibiting a non pilot from sitting there (what if he was getting dual given?).

Not to minimize your concern, just talking legalities.
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Old 04-29-2017, 05:43 PM   #3  
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In 91 it might have been legal. Crew are not required to physically occupy their control station at all times and I don't recall anything in 91 prohibiting a non pilot from sitting there (what if he was getting dual given?).

Not to minimize your concern, just talking legalities.
Actually under 91 there is a reg that prohibits a crew member from leaving his station unless nature calls.There is nothing that states that a non pilot cant sit in the pilot seat but we are talking about a high performance jet @ fl410 and the pax is a non pilot who needs more than flight instruction to sit there ..
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Old 04-30-2017, 03:53 AM   #4  
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'Part 91', 'right seat'? No expert opinion here, but sitting right seat for a reasonable period during cruise doesn't seem real crazy. This assumes the left seater is fully qualified.

As usual, the particulars factor in. JMHO.
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Old 04-30-2017, 04:57 AM   #5  
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Gvdriver View Post
Actually under 91 there is a reg that prohibits a crew member from leaving his station unless nature calls.There is nothing that states that a non pilot cant sit in the pilot seat but we are talking about a high performance jet @ fl410 and the pax is a non pilot who needs more than flight instruction to sit there ..
Physiological break could include stretching, and like you said nothing says the pax cannot sit there when the pilot is taking his break. Not suggesting it's a great idea.

But if the OP did not need a break, that would be grounds on his part to refuse to vacate the seat.
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Old 04-30-2017, 06:09 AM   #6  
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I'll just leave these here.......

Tape Confirms The Pilot's Son Caused Crash Of Russian Jet - NYTimes.com

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Aeroflot_Flight_593
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Old 04-30-2017, 07:03 AM   #7  
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Not enough info;

Type of airplane?
Phase of flight?
Qualifications of the guy in the left seat? Is he single pilot qualified?

Personally I wouldn't have a problem with it if we're in cruise with nothing needing to be done such as fuel transfer or weather avoidance or anything else that requires one of us to be head down.
Want to be in VMC also in case a symbol generator/ display screen or ADC takes a dump while I'm out of my seat.
Pilots call but I think you may have overreacted a little here.

'Not right now Sir, we are working on a couple of things. I will give you a call in about 10-15 min. That OK for you? Thank you Sir'

That shows him you're not afraid to exercise your duties as PIC and gives you time to confer with the guy in the LHS. What did he have to say about it anyway?
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Old 04-30-2017, 07:38 AM   #8  
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OWNER...look for another job before you have to look for another job, because your going to have another job sooner than later.
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Old 04-30-2017, 07:50 AM   #9  
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Originally Posted by TiredSoul View Post
Not enough info;

Type of airplane?
Phase of flight?
Qualifications of the guy in the left seat? Is he single pilot qualified?

Personally I wouldn't have a problem with it if we're in cruise with nothing needing to be done such as fuel transfer or weather avoidance or anything else that requires one of us to be head down.
Want to be in VMC also in case a symbol generator/ display screen or ADC takes a dump while I'm out of my seat.
Pilots call but I think you may have overreacted a little here.

'Not right now Sir, we are working on a couple of things. I will give you a call in about 10-15 min. That OK for you? Thank you Sir'

That shows him you're not afraid to exercise your duties as PIC and gives you time to confer with the guy in the LHS. What did he have to say about it anyway?
1.high performance jet
2.fl430
3.not a single pilot airplane
4.concurred with other crew

Owner has also been know for sticking his hand in the cockpit and flipping sws,opening the cabin door as we stop the airplane ( one of these day hes gona go flying out)

There was an accident in 2008 where the owner was sitting in the right seat... they found the FDR /CVR in the crater about 10ft down ...too bad we cant ask him what hewas thinking when he sat him there
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Old 04-30-2017, 07:55 AM   #10  
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Maybe a cop out on my part but your PIC needs to speak up here.
Or the Chief Pilot if you have one.
Issues with the owner shouldn't be yours to fight.
Then again, be diplomatic about it.
It may have been ok at that stage of the flight.
Not that it really matters but I'm assuming this is a Lear?
If the owner wants you out of the company then you're out.
That's why he's the owner.
Had nothing to do with fairness.
Just the way the cookie crumbles.
Start looking today just in case the hammer drops tomorrow.
Inappropriate doesn't always equal unsafe.

There's a rule under 135 where you're supposed to 'serve' the alcoholic beverages.
So how does that work if you can't get out of your seat?
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