PSA Crash with Helicopter at DCA…
02-02-2025 | 01:23 PM
#171
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Sorry, no hand hold/wideberth/training wheels and pushing the airliners out of the way
If it's the mantra that "they were qualified", THEN THEY WERE QUALIFIED
Just like there's no "CA/FO is on IOE" or "line check in progress" for the controller.
Last edited by John Carr; 02-02-2025 at 01:44 PM.
02-02-2025 | 01:42 PM
#172
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Everyone is getting wrapped up on the word "training." Not all training is the same. Should we also inform ATC anytime we are doing IOE or getting a line check?
02-02-2025 | 01:48 PM
#173
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The CA goes off all the time! Any place with VFR traffic will trigger it. VFR traffic in the pattern at SNA will set it off all the time. That's why the Tower will ask if you have the traffic. I bet that goes off in the DCA tower anytime a helicopter is near the airport.
02-02-2025 | 02:45 PM
#174
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From: Engines Turn or People Swim
The CA goes off all the time! Any place with VFR traffic will trigger it. VFR traffic in the pattern at SNA will set it off all the time. That's why the Tower will ask if you have the traffic. I bet that goes off in the DCA tower anytime a helicopter is near the airport.
02-02-2025 | 03:43 PM
#175
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The CA goes off all the time! Any place with VFR traffic will trigger it. VFR traffic in the pattern at SNA will set it off all the time. That's why the Tower will ask if you have the traffic. I bet that goes off in the DCA tower anytime a helicopter is near the airport.
And as far as the tower controller - man - that is heartbreaking. I cannot imagine being in his shoes, even if the report comes back saying he did it by the book. He got a CA and could do nothing. All the coulda, shoulda… It is unimaginable.
02-02-2025 | 04:32 PM
#177
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The system is not broken. The CA system is not designed to prevent mid-airs. It is designed to prevent controllers from getting distracted. To relate it to TCAS, it's more like a TA than an RA. When it goes off, the controller has to verify that at least one of the pilots is maintaining visual separation. It would be really hard to make a system that is sensitive enough the distinguish an actual potential mid-air vs. a plane that is pointing at an aircraft on a parallel runway but is going to turn final before they actually hit.
02-02-2025 | 05:02 PM
#178
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From: Baja Vermont
Sorry, but this is where the system is broken. Make everyone go around any time there is an alert. Eventually the powers that be should realize it is not working and come up with a solution. (Like no helicopter traffic within 100 ft!!!). Make it as expensive and as cumbersome for the airlines. I don’t care. I like to go around.
And as far as the tower controller - man - that is heartbreaking. I cannot imagine being in his shoes, even if the report comes back saying he did it by the book. He got a CA and could do nothing. All the coulda, shoulda… It is unimaginable.
And as far as the tower controller - man - that is heartbreaking. I cannot imagine being in his shoes, even if the report comes back saying he did it by the book. He got a CA and could do nothing. All the coulda, shoulda… It is unimaginable.
02-02-2025 | 05:20 PM
#179
Prime Minister/Moderator
Joined: Jan 2006
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From: Engines Turn or People Swim
The system is not broken. The CA system is not designed to prevent mid-airs. It is designed to prevent controllers from getting distracted. To relate it to TCAS, it's more like a TA than an RA. When it goes off, the controller has to verify that at least one of the pilots is maintaining visual separation. It would be really hard to make a system that is sensitive enough the distinguish an actual potential mid-air vs. a plane that is pointing at an aircraft on a parallel runway but is going to turn final before they actually hit.
It's just a reminder for the controller. The appropriate action is to verify visual separation, if not verified then give somebody a vector and/or a climb.
Although they might technically not even be required to verify visual separation, if that was previously called and they're busy with something else time critical. Sounds like it's an SA tool, not a hard guard rail.
02-02-2025 | 05:51 PM
#180
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