Airline Pilot Central Forums - Malaysian 777 missing

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Quote:

Originally Posted by JJ21 (Post 1610970)

Why has Malaysia Airlines not released the load manifest for their cargo? Why will they not state the number of batteries they were shipping? Why did they lie about the batteries being on board in the first place then change their story to say they were shipping batteries but that it was normal for airlines to do so?

You answered your own question. Why would they admit to anything unless the actual evidence points at them? This has the potential to put them out of business (Swissair). It's not a conspiracy. :rolleyes:

I'd say a cargo hold battery fire can be ruled out based on experience. First, the distribution of wiring and antennae means that a fire that took the transponder and VHF Comms would have triggered fire alarms and the halon suppression system. They would have time for a Mayday call, based on the UPS Dubai crash.

Second, any fire that large would have brought it down quickly, so the wreckage would be close to KL, not 6-7 hours flying time away. And a fire serious to wipe out the transponder and comms would have eventually, in not too long a time, wiped out the flight control computers. See UPS again.

I like the story in the Chinese HKG press that the pilot took the plane hostage trying to get the release of Anwar Ibrahim, but that idea can quickly be shot down. The Malaysian government couldn't be that stupid and corrupt or could they?

GF

Quote:

Originally Posted by galaxy flyer (Post 1611156)

I REALLY don't trust the airline OR government officials. I also don't know if they are stupid or corrupt, or both. Without knowing too much technical info as you pilots do, something still isn't adding up in my mind.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sorensen (Post 1610986)

From the missing plane?

Possible Fire Suppression Bottle of an aircraft lands on Maldives beach

Those look like the bottles on a B727or DC9 to me.

Quote:

Originally Posted by JJ21 (Post 1610972)

This was in the news:

Lithium metal batteries deliver extremely high densities of energy, and if they are mishandled they can catch fire, a fire that can't be extinguished with halon, the most common kind of fire-suppression systems in passenger aircraft.

That's one reason the FAA banned shipments of nonrechargeable lithium metal batteries on passenger planes in 2004. But that ban only applies in the United States; international authorities are still considering whether to enact such a rule. Cargo and passenger aircraft are free to carry lithium ion batteries, although they are subject to labeling and packing regulations.

So what was on board Flight 370? Malaysian officials, after saying the cargo manifest would "be released in due course," later got a little more specific and said the Boeing 777 was carrying 440 pounds of lithium ion batteries. What else? Nothing that would cause a problem, the Malaysians assure us.

An Australian news media report said the Malaysian government refused to release the manifest to the Australian government, which would find such information helpful as it tries to map out a search.

If you are a commercial pilot, you need to educate yourself regarding lithium batteries. If the 777 had 400 pounds of LiIon batteries on a pallet in the belly, the plane would have burned up quickly. Again, if you haven't looked at the UPS Dubai fire, that is what we're talking about. It is our worst nightmare. 400 pounds of batteries lighting off does not selectively turn off transponders, then the ACARS, then turn the plane to the west. It would burn the plane in half, not somehow magically incapacitate the occupants and fly for 6-7 more hours, then run out of gas.

Google any of the Youtube demos of lithium battery fires. It isn't pretty.

You clearly prefer conspiracy theories over rational (considering the facts so far) possibilities. I think someone opened up a bag of durian fruit and everyone passed out from the stench. Or black holes swallowed it up. Or a "shadow" aircraft did something to make it disappear. Where is Tom Clancy when we need him?

LightAttack...there have been 140 aircraft incidents/accidents involving lithium batteries...not all of the planes burned and crashed. It is highly possible that the toxic fumes entered into the cabin/cockpit and incapacitated the crew/pax....it is highly possible that a fire could have breached the pressure vessel and caused a rapid decompression....what happens to a fire during a rapid decompression? What happens when a fire is exposed to outside temperatures of around -40?

Even the Australian Govt wants to know more about these batteries.

How do you find lithium batteries to be a conspiracy theory based on the incident/accident history involving aircraft? Maybe you should stop reading Tom's books.

Do I think this is the only explanation for the aircraft crash...no, but it is one possibility.

As for the plane flying for 6-7 hours....how about Payne Stewarts aircraft flying for 5 hours with the crew/pax incapacitated crashing in North Dekota when it was flying from Florida to Texas. Just look up that accident...plus many others that happened in the same way.

Seriously open your mind set.

ps the NTSB has NOT ruled out anything yet...why? Because they don't have an AIRCRAFT to piece together to find out what happened...you can bet your bottom dollar they are NOT ruling out the lithium batteries as a possible cause...unlike you.

It's surprising how easy it is to identify the spotters and armchair experts on this thread...

We're not ruling it out, it's you that ruling out the scenarios that the circumstances and the few known facts are most likely--human intervention of some sort.

If lithium batteries did breach the pressure vessel at F350, the plane would NOT fly for seven hours after comms went out in a specific sequence.

I know all too much about the Stewart accident--batteries weren't the cause. You could look up the Helios accident for depressurization, too.

GF

Quote:

Originally Posted by F224 (Post 1611252)

Those look like the bottles on a B727or DC9 to me.

Memory serving me correct and all. It looks very similar if not the same to a 777 cargo fire suppression bottle.

Quote:

Originally Posted by F224 (Post 1611252)

Those look like the bottles on a B727or DC9 to me.

If you're talking about the photo of the dual bottles, my money is on a 737 install. That looks like the nasty left wheel well area where they're installed aft and outboard. Not sure about airbus or McD, but I don't recall seeing anything but round dual squibbed bottles on Boeings, including the 777.

http://cdn-www.airliners.net/aviatio.../0/1817037.jpg