This is somewhat disingenuous rhetoric by ALPA.

Yes, Virgin has added capacity across the Atlantic, but what ALPA doesn’t tell you is that VS has grown very little and has simply shifted flying from other markets to North America in support of the JV. The block hours their pilot group operates has been nearly flat since Delta purchased our 49% stake. I have a few contacts that fly over there and we discuss these issues occasionally.

That said, I’m in full support of comprehensive JV scope. I just felt compelled to call out ALPA’s slanted messaging.

I disagree with you. I don’t think it’s disingenuous of Dalpa. We shouldn’t give a rats *** about Virgin Atlantic’s total flying. We, Dalpa, are only concerned with the JV flying and they have added significantly to it while we have not.

Where their additional JV block hours come from (new planes or shifting equipment) doesn’t really matter. Again, we should only be concerned about JV hours.

Denny

"US-UK growth has gone almost exclusively to Virgin, and Delta now flies fewer flights between London LHR and New York JFK than it did before the JV."

Delta pilots could not care, because...[finish this sentence].

Until someone can tell me why I shouldn't care, I do. And since my job and other American jobs matter, I'm glad the MEC is petitioning those involved with Blue Skies approval.

Same here .. scope and QOL is my main concern on this contract.

Last year they said the Aeromexico JV netted each pilot something like $2.50 in profit sharing.

I know this thread is about the Atlantic but that number made me realize that a JV doesn't increase my bank account by as much as operating one of those flights once in a year.

JVs provide domestic feed too. Without those international flights, we wouldn’t have as many domestic ones, nor the domestic captains and first officers that fly them. The value to pilots is more than just profit sharing.

Nonetheless, we need equitable growth going forward with Aeromexico, Korean, and the rest. +Scope on this next contract

Seems that most of our Scope language deals with minimum amounts of flying performed. We need language that deals with how growth will be split up. Seems that should of been codified when said JV was signed, oh well.......

Lets fix that Sh!t now!

Agreed. I think the solution should contain at least 2 metrics, block hours and easks.

Denny

it's certainly less than the paycheck you would be getting if Delta had more widebody's of its own and you were on that instead of a narrow body.... Food for thought, UA has SFO 777 FO's at like 8 months on their latest vacancy award. $174/hr 2nd yr pay, $204/hr 3rd yr pay

You need to look across the entire list. As a example what does a Delta 757 pay verses a UAL757. You also need to factor in how much lower are profit sharing would be with UAL’s fleet mix.