CS/DX has a work-around for that which is what I've been talking about...

They'll come up with a bogus determination that you'll be legal to make the return flight, therefore they'll force you to go. Usually involves 3-minute taxi times, cruise at .83, or the like.

Once you arrive at the outstation, then they "re-evaluate" the legalities and "realize" you're stuck. Yes you can just rent a car and drive home, but they're accepting that risk on the assumption that it will be easier for you to just work the return flight.

Seen it happen many times. I think they actually look at your home address to make sure it's not convenient for you to just go home rather than RON. When I told them I was going home the last time this happened, they actually told me they didn't see any flights that would get me to my home town that night. I told them, yeah but you stranded me in my parents home town... See Yah!

I know of what I speak. You might fool me once, but rarely twice.

 

You don't get it. If it's been a jacked up day and now you are waiting hours to finish up a turn that's the last 2 legs of your trip and you know you're going to be fatigued on the final leg back, why not call in preemptively? All the company cares about is completions, that's how they get payed. They don't care about you, me, or the paxs, just the completion.

If you go out on a turn and get to your destination and then call fatigued, just like another poster said, they will send you to a hotel and bring you back out to finish 10 hours later. How do you think the rest of your crew is going to enjoy going to the hotel and coming back out when it might have been their day off and with possibly no clothes if it was a local?

If another crew did that to me, I'd be furious!

That would be the b*tch move!

 

Yes but in this case he wasn't even close, 15.5 before even departing. They would have had to release him to a hotel or dh home.

 

Yes, they can only game it if it's close.

In this case he *should* have been able to refuse due to the time out, RON into day off scenario.

The problem is they don't give you the option to refuse. If you do that, and they don't accept it gracefully, then you had damn well better be right about the (nebulous and ever changing) policy or you could be in a world of hurt. Puts you in a tough position. Especially since you'll need to rely on SAPA to back you up.

Flat out refusing to fly without sick/emer/fatigue could get you fired. I'd venture that if you have any previous history, it will get you fired.

Willing to bet your career on something RJ said in conference call last year?

 

Or...get an effing contract that prohibits this and requires the company to return you to domicile by the end of your RAP.

LIKE EVERY OTHER CARRIER.

 

My first alpa regional would do the same thing. If you pointed out it was a contract violation, they'd laugh, and tell you to fly it and grieve it. If you won the grievance you'd get an hour of penalty pay six months later.

A union *might* stabilize the contract, minimizing random changes cooked up by the company and certain sapa peeps. But it would still depend on who you elect... a self serving MEC can screw the pilot group just as fast and hard as sapa.

Recommended union bylaw #1: No elected union rep can accept a management position with the company for ten (10) years following completion of their term. Bucking for a company position? Then don't run for office...

There's a hack for everything... the loophole for bylaw #1 will be an exception for those who lose their medical. Well guess what, any pilot can lose his damn medical any time he pleases. Don't let them write that loophole into the language.

 

Mec members are elected by line pilots. Mec members can be recalled by line pilots. That's the fix to ANY hack. Everything else is just an excuse.

 

Mostly works at a major... everybody is an adult, and nobody just fell of the truck.

Regional... not so much. Half the FO's are clueless noobs, the other half, and about half of the CA's, just want their PIC and out.

It would work better at a stagnate regional, with 10+ year upgrades.

 

I thought I was going to be the plug. Man was I wrong. Junior captain went 6/17. Crazy.

 

And all of this is before the 45 new E175’s. (Ok. We have taken 2 of the 45) just think this spring when were deep in to ERJ Training.. that will cause tons more movement... basically under 6 month upgrade the next year. ..