Originally Posted by e6bpilot

Lance captain has been dealt many blows over the years, but it's still around. We haven't heard a thing about them changing it right now, so I doubt it will be touched in this contract.
Not sure why the company would want it gone. Pretty sure it's a net positive for them. I always hear that rumor from other pilots who are "in the know", but most of those guys are full of $hit. It's a FAA approved program that has been with us for a very long time and many thousands of flying hours.
The ones who want it gone are mid to upper seniority captains who see lances flying trips that they can't hold or beating their TFP numbers with better vacation weeks. Typical pilot jealousy ruining someone's good deal that they may have even taken part in just because they don't like someone else getting it. The best I can tell, swapa has tried to kill it twice in two separate TA1s. The first time the compromise ended up being that lances could only pick up 10 captain duty periods per month. The last time they did away with that but then made it so you could only Lance for a year.
It is still an amazing deal for a senior FO or junior captain and it forces you to get out of your comfort zone and be a good pilot in both seats.

Originally Posted by Cyio

Lee stated he is uncomfortable with the idea that in the near future we could see green on green pilots in their seats.

I question the merit that it helps the transition. Given no other airline does it and they are all just fine I don’t buy that it makes you a better captain.

Originally Posted by Proximity

The constant stream on 80-100 new hires showing up in BWI each month is proof that the "you get a hard line your first" month thing needs to go away.

If you are new and haven't consolidated, you shouldn't be able to change your reserve pref to "pass". And if that doesn't get you the hours needed, the company can buy some trips off.

Rather then constantantly subjugating the senority of 100 more senior FOs.

Originally Posted by e6bpilot

I call BS. I am currently lancing and have never heard that spoken or seen it written by LK or anyone else in flight ops management. The only pilots I have seen throwing shade at the Lance program are those no longer eligible for it, many who actually did it and are pulling the ladder up.

Green on green happens every day right now at this airline. You are far more likely to have two pilots with less than 100 hours in their respective seats on a Friday-Sunday 3 day reserve pairing than you are with a Lance captain who is more than likely flying during the week with a senior FO. I have nearly a year of experience doing both options and I can tell you that the relative seniority of my right seat partners as a Lance is way, way higher than it was when I was a fresh captain on the line. Often my FO is more senior than I am.

I never said it helps the transition. I said it makes you a better pilot in both seats. The fact that other airlines don't do it is a red herring. We do it and have successfully for decades. Point me to the evidence of lances doing anything dumb and/or dangerous and I'll start listening.

Originally Posted by Cyio

He literally said it to my classes face at leadership. You can call BS all you want, all I was saying is that he said he wants it gone for the reason I stated.

He even said they were discussing it that day. Who knows, maybe it goes nowhere but that’s what he said. I know why people like it, it offers amazing trip bidding power with trading and board stacking.

We shall see, it effects me very little either way the ball rolls. Don’t kill the messenger.

Ih and sorry about misquoting you. You are correct you didn’t use the word transition but you did say it would make you a better pilot in both seats. The act of moving from one seat to the other is a transition.

Originally Posted by e6bpilot

Well then I apologize since you heard it first hand, but if that's his reason it's a stupid one and completely flies in the face of logic. Much like everything I have ever heard in leadership classes and training briefs, it is completely false. Most of our Lance captains can hold captain in the base of their choice and they fly with more senior first officers since they punch above their seniority weight.
He has proven to be every bit as inspiring and effective in that job as a wet sock. I suspect he will climb the ladder quite nicely into a cushy SVP position.
I have no personal stake in it either way. My time is wrapping up. I just want it preserved for the next generation so that they can enjoy it as much as I have, but that has always been a weakness of mine. I don't mind someone else getting a good deal.

Originally Posted by e6bpilot

he has proven to be every bit as inspiring and effective in that job as a wet sock.

Originally Posted by MatthewAMEL

Lance needs to die a quick death. It's a bad program that helps the company and does very little for the group. It's an offshoot of the old 'up or out' mentality.

If you need a CA slot in that domicile, make it a CA slot and put someone in the CA seat full-time. You'd easily get 15-20 CA slots at almost every domicile immedately.

Originally Posted by e6bpilot

He has proven to be every bit as inspiring and effective in that job as a wet sock.

Originally Posted by WHACKMASTER

Are we talking about LK or BoJo here? I’d argue that the above assessment applies to both.

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