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For those of you developing a “suck it up” attitude towards those displaced, I realize you’re trying to protect seniority, but the fact remains we are the only airline I am aware of that can flat out displace you (remove what your own seniority has already awarded you) and then keep you out with a DRR while letting other senior bubbas come and go at will. DRR rarely gets employed with the way we wrote it and it fits right into the same category as fake news.
DRR was not written as well as it was intended, but most importantly as it’s already been stated, we need to make Displacements hurt bad for the company if we want to minimize them in the future. |
Originally Posted by REF 5
(Post 4027388)
So only DEN pilots should fly DEN turns? Same with other domiciles? Trip rigs, duty rigs, APL, shouldn’t matter? We are in the business of moving metal around all day, every day. Especially in a heavy p2p operation. DEN is not on an island. It’s connected to the network. They all have to flow into each other or else we would need 1600 airplanes just run the operation as is. We are in a low margin business. Ain’t gonna happen. Allegiant and Frontier do that though. Again I feel for you guys but trying to skin the scheduling cat in “turns” is kinda far fetched. Rigs are just as much to blame for this as is RON stuff. It forces the cost of keeping you DEN with soft pay scenarios vs displacing you which costs nothing. That equation has to change to modify the behavior of the company. You have been long enough to know that the only thing that creates change around here is real costs. That’s all they know.
maybe it’s a thing here…I’ve just never seen it…especially for the majority of trips in a line bid out of a base where the majority of those displaced out of DEN were sent to. Maybe they’re trying to do us a solid…or they’re ****ing those off who want turn lines because we refused to make it a % of a base bid pack vs system bid. LGA turns are day trips as long as I was based there just like CUN, SJD, PVR turns. Just like MCO-SJU turns are likely MCO based…I’ve never done it as a west coast based pilot. Never done PUJ overnights either…we don’t see them. Or AUA, or any other Caribbean turn. Never seen it on the DEN bid pack. You can call it “efficiency”…but how well do you think it would go over in MCO. BWI, HOU, etc if the high credit turns typically specific to those bases suddenly got farmed out to another base? Can’t see how that is cheaper..if it were it would’ve been staffed by other bases long before April ‘26. Not sure what CO did to Sutcliffe in a previous life but I wouldn’t **** on him if he were on fire. And that’s being nice. |
Originally Posted by REF 5
(Post 4027388)
It forces the cost of keeping you DEN with soft pay scenarios vs displacing you which costs nothing. That equation has to change to modify the behavior of the company.
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Originally Posted by 4V14T0R
(Post 4027200)
I simply disagree. Being junior sucks. What the company did was a crappy thing to do (putting it nicely to get passed APC's rules). We should not be disregarding seniority for it though. Most people will be back in their base of choice this year. I will vote against anything that does more than we already do wrt negating seniority. Pin it on the company all you want and you got my vote.
bingo. This ain’t our problem to fix. It sucks, but being junior does. that sound you hear is me you unapologetically yanking the ladder up behind me because I’ve finally got some seniority. |
Originally Posted by flyguy81
(Post 4026883)
Since Crew planing builds the lines…I want to know who the moron was that thought it was a smart, efficient use of crew utilization to kick people out of DEN to LAS and then having LAS trips with 3 DEN overnights.
Some airlines utilize out of base crews because Table B is limiting. Early starts flown from one time zone to the right and late finishes flown from one time zone to the left. If a LAS crew lands late in DEN they have higher utilization then letting a DEN crew land late, because they are acclimated to LAS when they consult Table B for duty day limits. |
Originally Posted by DirkDiggler9999
(Post 4027160)
What’s Sutcliffe’s background?
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Originally Posted by OpieTaylor
(Post 4027515)
Some airlines utilize out of base crews because Table B is limiting. Early starts flown from one time zone to the right and late finishes flown from one time zone to the left.
If a LAS crew lands late in DEN they have higher utilization then letting a DEN crew land late, because they are acclimated to LAS when they consult Table B for duty day limits. There’s no acclimating needed if you’re doing a day trip that starts around noon and finishes before midnight. At the end of the day they’re gonna do whatever the heck they want with total disregard for our QOL and when it finally starts to cost them $$$$, they’ll change it. It’s our job (or the head shed at Swapa’s to throw data in their face ASAP to get changes made quickly). |
Originally Posted by CA1900
(Post 4027437)
That right there is the highlight. They displaced hundreds of people because it was the least expensive option that complied with our CBA. Lesson learned for the next CBA. Make displacements more expensive, and they'll be less likely to happen and to drag on the way they have.
He doesn't grasp that RON is not the only metric to determine staffing. I wish the union would take a look at DEN hotel costs since the displacements. I keep seeing LAS/BNA/PHX crews overnighting in DEN. |
Originally Posted by MatthewAMEL
(Post 4027569)
I wish the union would take a look at DEN hotel costs since the displacements. I keep seeing LAS/BNA/PHX crews overnighting in DEN.
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Originally Posted by CA1900
(Post 4027571)
They should look at the transportation as well. That far hotel that's 45 minutes each way must be costing a fortune in shuttle costs.
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