I do not think you need worry about out source. These rate with this rules and other companies will out source to us.

Why 5 yr contract? - industry standard right? Just like pay, retirement, rig, ltd. Just wondering, other airlines pay for ltd to?

Norweigean, WoW, frontier, and every airline in Latin America does it for less, as well as countless airlines yet to be started by greedy management flown by inexperienced kids wanting to just live a dream.

I think Delta’s contract was 3 years last round. United had a me too in their “standard” duration to not be left behind.

Yes own occupation LTD is industry standard. Premiums are variable across the industry as well as max benefit. Delta also contributes to your retirement while on LTD which is industry leading

Sweet! I’m happy to know this potential contract will put us ahead of Norwegian, Wow, and Frontier. Where do I sign?!

That wasn’t the point but I get yours and I agree

How is this? NK has grown from 37 airplanes to 112 and pushing towards 161. There's even a new order that just needs to be confirmed. The pilot ranks have swelled from 600 to almost 2000. Classes are being filled, flights are being completed, our on time is up, our profits are soaring, and we have over $1 billion in the bank.

Meanwhile, our FO's are living on food stamp wages fighting off creditors, our Captains aren't making what other FO's are making, our scope has more holes than Swiss cheese, and we have 'welcome to Walmart' LTD.

I don't know if this TA is a turd or a hero but I can assure you that we are the ones who need a deal more than Miriamar.

EXACTLY. Those thank think the company wants or has any desire to get a contract done are dreaming. If that was the case then this would have been done long ago without the NMB having to drag the company to negotiations.

It’s pretty common for management to have ALPA sign a letter agreeing to support the TA. Don’t let that sway your decision. In the past, the union would put out a pro/con paper but now with agreements to support a TA, those don’t come out anymore. You guys have a tough decision. It’s a substantial improvement, but is it enough. Good luck with your decisions.

At Delta, our MEC Chairman resigned after the failure of TA1 (he would have been ridden out of town on a rail if he hadn’t) so we had to elect another one before reengaging the company and we still had a much better TA in 6 months.

I have yet to hear a coherent plan if this TA gets voted down how we would move forward. Who would step forward for MEC chairman? Who would step up to the plate for the NC? What is the plan to reengage the company? Think the company will come crawling back? Think again! The only reason we are where we are today is WE reengaged the NMB who then got the company back to the table. The company did not come crawling back on their knees, nor would they likely in the future. Future aircraft orders? No longer in the plan according to the last earnings call or the investor presentation slides. They may be looking to grow, just not necessarily organically (how’s our current scope again?). Hiring issues? Not a problem at present. The December bid did give me some hope, but it appears to have been a fluke. If this current deal is cost neutral as some would like you to believe, then why hasn’t the company done it long ago?! That defies logic....

The lack of a plan B is what gives me the most hesitation for voting no. That said, once I read it, there may be enough poison pills where I’m willing to walk away.... We shall see.

Current scope is poor but how is scope in the ta? We will see tomorrow

So, hypothetically, if there is an improvement in scope, but it doesn’t meet your personal muster, you’d automatically vote no without taking the other sections into consideration? Seems similar to those who automatically look at section 3, look at the rates, and automatically say no....

I’ve got news for you, there is no such thing as ‘iron clad’ scope. Southwest is close, though. Along those lines, if we have anything less than Southwest scope, you’d vote no?