No. We can guarantee you that nobody at a legacy, zero, would care about it. It was just that guy you ran into that said eff that guy, he’s the only one that cares. Just a one-off, he’s very special.

Oh ok look at you making a difference

Yes and no. Within your pilot group you are of course free to discuss such things and even hold a grudge.

But on APC, you cannot take it to the point of advocating for work-to-rules, etc. We've had multiple cases of such posts being used against unions, including NK-ALPA not that long ago.

It is true that the APC lurker/poster ratio is about 100/1 (after accounting for bots).

what are you basing your opinion on? Are you currently a union pilot? Because it sounds like you're just making things up as you go along.

Your reasoning is solid, that it is poor form to pick up trips above and beyond your normal line award, to benefit yourself while pilots are on furlough. And too brag about is terrible. But it’s still not “s” territory. And making a list to threaten such action is what the Union is saying NOT to do. Threatening your own Union pilots goes against the Union’s wishes. This is not what it means to be a union member, that is the disgraceful behavior that needs to be addressed. We are supposed to be looking out for each other, not trying to get our brothers and sisters terminated or keeping them from employment. Making a list based off of a vendetta is the true anti Union behavior.

I’ve flown with an F/O on his way to a legacy that carries the same opinion. I tried to share my perspective, but his mind seemed made up. He seemed convinced that this behavior was unacceptable and list worthy

Damn that hotel cuck chair is working overtime :D

After the first round of furloughs, I flew with more than one FO picking up well above guarantee at straight pay. They were all lower time and newer to the industry, and had pretty much zero awareness for what was playing out at NK.

The mindset was "I need to get my hours up to get a call from xyz legacy." And it worked.

Zero consequences that I am aware of and I doubt that anyone at the big 3 even cares at all.


I certainly wouldn't advocate for what happened, but their are lots of people on here beating their chests against such behavior like it would be a serious roadblock to one's career.

And the sad truth is that it really doesn't matter. It doesn't change anything.

Wow just wow….ALPA failed to train the newest generation of pilots how to act as a member of a union. If only there was a list of these people so they never ride on our jumpseats agan….

Your reasoning only works in a perfect world. If someone screws over their Union brothers and sisters to get a leg up, there needs to be consequences. If not the old guard will slowly go away and all that’s left are the ones eating each other for any advantage, than what’s the point

You guys need to wise up
 

If you know anything at all about labor relations, you’ll know that maintaining the status quo is vital. If you picked up premium or straight time before furloughs, you should probably continue to do so now. Failure to do so opens the door to a lawsuit. This happened when I was at NK years ago.
Refusing to work overtime won’t bring anyone back any sooner….

Using your company email to communicate said matters is why the lawsuit arose. That was stupid. Refusing to work overtime by simple logic brings people back sooner. They can either cancel or bing people back, if they can cover the flying people stay on the streets. How is this hard to understand.

Whats not to say that people stop picking up X/Y to work on a degree or volunteer to pad the resume? That lawsuit was the bigger crock of crap I’ve ever heard.

Also, there’s a reason we use our personal emails with the union and not our company emails. Whoever used their company email REALLY messed up.

If I fly an X list am I screwing over a furlough? What if I drop my schedule and fly less than the average pilot? What if I work 120 hrs this month, and 20 hrs for the next 2 months? Can you really determine if I’m screwing over a fellow union pilot by looking only at my x list trip I’m flying today? Are you now screwing me over by spreading misinformation about me based on your assumptions? Should there be consequences for you? How do you know the answers to these questions? You don’t, unless you make assumptions and live in a perfect world.

We need to look out for each other, whether it’s furloughed pilots or pilots making difficult decisions with whatever situation they face. Let’s not pretend we know what the answers to all these questions. Reasonable minds can disagree.

The legal problem occurs where there is...

1. A quantifiable change in behavior, not otherwise reasonably explained, change in work behavior.

2. An associated documentation of discussion/advocacy for same.

Technically they can even make the case without #2 but if you give it to them, it's a slam dunk.

Happy Easter everyone. I hope you all saw the awesome news. 200% for anything that touches Friday through Sunday. Pilots and FAs. Enjoy being the highest paid pilots this weekend.

This has to be "bendo-ver"! If you truly are a pilot at Spirit .......you're an embarassament! Complete tool.......

Who is Bendo-ver?

pick up open time …. Yes you are screwing over a furloughed pilot. It’s so painfully obvious I’m not sure if you are trolling. Also wtf are you talking about assumptions? I simply said picking up open time while people are on the street is not cool. I made ZERO assumptions. All this is is NK pilots eating other NK pilots to get a buck. ALPA is a disgrace for allowing what has happened to happen. And now we have a generation of Union pilots who will pick up open time while their brothers and sisters are on the streets.

Reasonable minds can disagree….nothing that you do or say is reasonable. Accusing me of making assumptions, I never made any… not even one. Picking up open time with peps on the street and trying to rationalize it is not reasonable. It’s shameful.

Is this the guy with the painted Bare Fare leather jacket? I remember you shouting from the top of your lungs that NKS pilots were the highest paid Airbus drivers in the world back in 2022.

reading comprehension skills are hard, this might be a difficult concept, but try to follow. You are saying that someone is screwing someone else over by picking up open time, full stop. I’m asking you, that if I drop all my trips and then pick up one open time trip, that is screwing over pilots on the street? There are plenty of scenarios out there that pilots pick up open time or premium trips and are flying less than the average line holder. If you’re thinking that just because someone picks up a trip that they are now guilty of some shameful act then that is an assumption. I don’t know what else to tell you. Reasonable minds can disagree. Unreasonable minds cry, complain, and call people names.

Why does this have to become another nasty thread of name calling, hate and negativity? This is the good news thread ONLY.

It seems triggering for some that us spirit holdouts are actually happy and excited for the new hires about to come onboard. We know how great his place is and QOL will continue to improve when we start taking deliveries again next year. (If we aren’t acquired)

The two bankruptcies really broke some “spirits”. Any former NK pilots lurking the “good news thread” trying to sh*t on our occasional snippets of good news really needs to step back and think about the miserable person they have become.

There are not new hires because of growth. They are replacing people that are leaving at a rapid rate. This is why people are not super excited.

This is good news tho because it shows they are still trying to run the airline, but can they get these people trained and flying fast enough to cover trips fast enough is the question.

There is a significant schedule reduction May onwards- So it looks like they are trying to tackle the issue on both ends, flying less, and recruiting enough to stem the attrition. In a way trying to shrink but hiring everyone they can at the same time.

Still didn’t explain how I assumed anything…..
Opinions and assumptions are two separate things that’s what you seem to not understand

keep picking up open time, rationalize it however you want.

it’s a troll poster. Probably Halon, but a troll
nonetheless. There have been various iterations of this kind of poster trolling this spirit sub forum

Your Assumption: Picking up open time in any way regardless of the broader context of one’s schedule is always harmful to furlough pilots.

Your Opinion: A Pilot who picks up open time with pilots on furlough, regardless of the broader context of that pilots schedule, is always shameful.

Notice how your judgment/opinion is based on your Assumption? You don’t even realize you’re making an assumption, that is extremely common with people who have heated opinions. Without your assumption, your opinion falls away.

Your assumption: it’s ok to help the company and make a little extra while you’re at it, that doesn’t affect recalls at all

Your opinion: assisting in covering open time, thus reducing staffing requirements, does not delay recalls. Instead of bringing a brother back to cover that trip, they can continue chillaxing at home while you step up to the plate.

Notice how your judgment/opinion is based on your Assumption? You don’t even realize you’re making an assumption, that is extremely common with people who have heated opinions. Without your assumption, your opinion falls away.

Regardless of the broader context of your schedule, people who are furloughED can't pick up anything until the company has enough open time to justify recalls.

And just to be clear I do not work at Spirit, I am not calling for a job action, and I do not support job actions. There should be no collusion, planning, plotting, group think, or concerted effort; withdrawal of enthusiasm is a real threat if they can prove it.

But it is up to us to mentor the next generation and give them both sides of the story before they taint themselves.

I also do not support list making and retribution, maxxxing your schedule with fellow pilots is not illegal just morally bankrupt and depraved. It doesn’t seem to concern those that undertake it, so all we can hope for is natural karma

That’s not how it works. They aren’t furloughed and recalled based on pilots picking up too much open time or not picking open time up. Any amount that becomes leverage becomes a work action.

Agree. Maxing out schedule is poor form and bragging about it is distasteful. Again though, one month max out and 3 months drop to minimum. That’s the context that ultimately matters. Not to mention it really doesn’t affect that grand scheme of things unless it’s a work action size that creates leverage, and that is illegal. I certainly agree, that looking out for yourself only and maximizing your own gains while others are on the street is distasteful.

This thread is exhausting

….thats not an assumption.The funny thing is you made the assumption.

Also Jdub 2 nailed it. Nice job Jdub2

Good things are happening behind the scenes. Just a little longer and you will see it was all worth it.

Sincerely,

TheCalmCaptain.

P.S. great job this past week! Fuel burn per segment is way down and crew reliability is near 100%. Zero controllable cancellations!

dude if NK shuts down after all this gaslighting people are going to blanket party you

Where do I sign up?

In other words, "When the **** did we get ice cream?"

Excellent! 🤣🤣🤣