Maybe I misunderstood your previous posts??

Speaking for me, unless the contract is the whole package, then my vote is NO. My package includes improvements to Scope, LTD, pay and retirement. That's my "line" in the sand.

Focused or not......

Right on! The whole package! But, any touching of our qol rules is a NO vote. I want improvements to scope, LTD, pay, retirement, I want meaningful merger protection, and health care improvements. I want to make sure we don't sell tickets for our passenger that some rj pilots are going to fly, I want assurances that if I lose my GOVERNMENT-MANDATED license due to a minor physical issue that I'm not out on my a$$ (this is a profession, not a job) without protection, I want pay commiserate with what my peers are earning, for the type of aircraft I'm flying, for the number of paying passengers in my care and responsibility, I want a retirement plan (401K is suitable) that won't leave me penniless when I retire because the government says I can't fly anymore, I want health care that I can afford for myself and my family and I want the work rules that make this place, Spirit Airlines, a place I want to work at rather than I have to work at. I want NO changes to my four days off, to my line bidding, to my transition conflict, to my vacations. We, the pilots have the GREATEST influence on how this company operates and we have been damn successful! It's about time we've been rewarded for that success!!!

I'm not saying I'm voting yes if only scope and ltd are improved. I'm saying that if they aren't I don't care what the rest of the contract says because I will vote no.

Okay, I can respect that.

A resounding no.

But what is the Alternative to Transition? What do you see as an acceptable replacement or resolution.

Yep, Joey's right. SWA has pretty great schedules.. Next time you JS on them or know a SWA guy, look at his schedule.. We think our work rules are sooo much better than everyone else's.. We have it average here. I'd trade transition too.. For SWA rates and rigs.

Spread that cost out. There are Multiple ways, some of which........

Pay rate
Retirement
Vacation
Trip rig
Etc

Why keep a system that benefits such a small number of pilots and essentially costs everyone else by lost income that could be made by selling it.

I see what you plan on getting in return for giving up Transition, but not how you see Conflicts being resolved during Transition.

Drop w/ No Pay Protection?
Let them figure it out?
1 Off in 7, so that the end/beginning of every month is a terrible schedule?

Or do you only see $$$$$$$$$$

Sadly, I don't have answer for ya :)

Or we can we look at a different way.

The few (10-15%) that benefit directly from it do make more, but upward movement is also worth something and the majority of the list is still moving at a pretty decent clip.

So.... what's the effect on staffing? Is it the 'right' time to trade it for a few bucks ($15K per pilot, per year, is the number I've heard thrown out)?

Or should we wait for one more cycle???

Or based on FOkras' post, maybe never.

Most people see Transition as a money grab, but it's really a QOL protection. We just turn it into a money grab, because we have **** pay rates. How do you guys see Transition playing out in the future without our current protections?

Remove without pay?

Let scheduling figure out how to make you legal?

1 Off in 7?

Guarantee 4 Days off?

These are things you really need to think about before chasing the dollars.

As I have said earlier, we need a pay raise to bring us in line with our peers. There is no justification for giving up any of our work rules, period! Transition conflict language needs to remain!

We have some work rules that are better than the industry and have some that are worse than the industry. It averages out to close to industry standard. Many of you here on this board are willing to give up the good things in our contract to get what we would already have gotten. What do you propose we get in return, higher pay that we already are going to get?

Lets look at what we don't get that the industry gets. Premium pay for work on days off, premium pay for flying above guarantee, premium pay for red eye flying, getting paid out of the sick bank for lost trips via commuting, PROFIT SHARING CHECKS, PENSION PLAN, much better trips rigs and duty rigs, stronger language for scope.........

Lets not give up what we have and get nothing in return. The pay has to come giving a look at the equipment we fly and the profits the company makes. Stay strong and united as a pilot group.

How about NO alternative, NO replacement or resolution. Like you said earlier about chasing $$$ just look at American.

That's exactly why I posed the question.

You say look at AA, i'm genuinely asking because I don't know much about their work rules. What type of schedules do they have over there?

Their work rules are basically part 117 limited. Currently line bid but will transition to pbs in the future. Hotels generally not as good as ours. Many of the work rules are regionalesque.

Although, best industry pay for most if not all equipment and a 16% if all wages retirement contribution. Do I want their contract? No, but $31k into my 401k every year does sound nice.

I'm guess there's going to be some CHAOS from one of our fellow work groups soon!

Attachment 2479 Professor Chaos!!

Lol, was quite a scathing letter from the AFA wasn't it, lol

Yes it was.. Coming into the perfect time of year for a little CHAOS..

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=HIcIIBTJA6o

Sounds like a sh×× storm is coming??

It's always "the weather".

Serious question.. Has bendo been a part of building any successful airline or business? His resume is full of destruction. Looks like he was in on the beginnings of Compass.. which I thought was put together as an alter ego to get around scope rules imposed on Mesaba and Pinnacle at the time??

So glad he will be on our side when we merge with Frontier;););)

Doubt they will see a release anytime soon, certainly not by the holidays.

True. Going on 8 years for them, one would think getting released wouldn't matter anymore.

Guess they could go this route....:D

Crazy Frenchies...

Air France Execs Forced to Flee as Angry Workers Storm Meeting

How did you guys get a letter from the AFA? Can you post a link?

I was told by our F/A that in their contract it states they are "Not allowed" to strike?

Correct, I think they can only do choas. If it came to that, and I were in management, I'd lock them out to send a message. Shut it down a few days and see if they cave.

No sympathy they've been going on 8 years?

I said if I were management douchebag. Go troll your own thread.

Fortunately or unfortunately I'm not banging any flight attendants so I don't have the info you guys speak of. What's this letter?

It was sent out to their membership. You don't have to bang a F/A to talk to them :), just as next time you work

I'm not familiar with this technique

It's far more complicated and requires learning about cats and their many fascinating grooming habits

Not sure I'd use that CRM time to talk CBAs...


http://us7.campaign-archive2.com/?u=0320604f9f8accd915c215da6&id=5797674c4b

Testy eh? So, put your management cap back on. If your pilot leadership suspended the CBA for 5 days to help you out, why would you give them huge/large gains for the next contractual negotiations?

You mad bro?

Winner winner chicken dinner! But hey, our MEC leader is making huge gains playing Scrabble with BB and waxing bendos sachel, so our TA is just around the corner!

Who is?.....................