You know what Norman, I think you're a pilot that legitimately sides with your union leaders because you believe that they stand in the breach for you. I understand, when you work for an employer like Spirit, taking your elected leaders side against the company is the default position. I understand and respect that.

I can't see what you think, and I'm not a mind reader. But it's obvious that you haven't ever had a personal conversation with me. Call me if you like. Until then, I don't have the time to dignify your assertions on this public board.

I do have time for one topic: My opposition to the strike vote and my position that the union was operating on the promise that we would not strike.

I opposed the strike vote because we were making a bluff. We had no strike center, no strike awareness committee, no family awareness committee, no SPC, etc. Our strike vote was obviously a bluff. For that reason, I opposed taking a strike vote. I called my rep and was assured that we would NOT use the strike authorization vote to actually strike. You may, and I'm sure you will, have your own opinion of that statement. I will swear that I heard exactly that. Again, we were bluffing and they called our bluff, to the tune of another year.

Call me if you feel like.

This was not even aimed at you because you are not a mud thrower. So why reply? If you don't want to use this forum that is fine. But the other board is simply not a level playing field since certain union members are banned. That is a fact too. I should actually add that to my list:

- What shall we think about a group of people that silences the opposition by banning them from their website?

Is that honest behavior?

Perhaps we should have a forum under the ALPA spc site.

I volunteered/worked at the strike center.

I went to at least one family awareness picnic.

I was taken out to dinner by one of the Delta guys (ALPA strike preparedness committee?) that was there to help us run/coordinate the strike.

Personally, I thought the strike was well run and organized with the result that “most” could live with.....

To vote “No” (2%) for a strike and then “No” (26%) after the strike, I think some might not understand where you “stand” or what you want(ed)???

We have talked, as you know.... we have an agreement to disagree on some things. I know ultimately you want the same I as well as most the pilot group; just a “different road” on how to get there??

At the end of the day.. “I am happy to be here”

Hey wait a second. If they worked every month the maximum hours of flying they did could only be 83 (which is 1000 for the year). If they got premium pay it only made a point to the company that they need to bring guys back. The company furloughed because they got rid of planes. What am I missing here?

I was really hoping to move past this to heal all the insults and hate towards each other for a better understanding amongst us, is the ONLY way ahead, specially for the next round.
Last thing we need is two separate groups going against a unified management.

If it wasn't aimed at me, why did you begin post #5459 with one of my quotes and begin post #5460 with, "you know what skybolt"?

I didn't say anything about the spirit pilot board. I only said that I'm not going to discuss your assertions on a public board. Again, you may call me if you like.

Really?, I expect better than this from you.

The strike center you worked was not in existence when the strike authorization vote was taken

Not before the strike authorization vote.

Fifteen or so months AFTER the strike authorization vote.

Agreed, but the entire system was built after the strike authorization vote. Not before like it should have been in order to show any "teeth" to the company. Which is EXACTLY the point I was making at the time. I opposed the timing of the vote, not the act of asking pilot permission to strike. I suspected, from personal experience with the anti union anti labor counselors employed by Spirit, that a strike vote would be ignored because we had no structure in place to actually carry out a strike. We built the structure, we built our army, AFTER the vote - not before. You had dinner with the Delta SPC guys. I attended four National SPC training events with those very same Delta SPC guys. I, along with our then SPSC Chair JS, worked with those very same guys to gain a $2Million negotiation/strike support grant. I will assure you that they trained us to build the army, "mass it on the borders", and show that you would and COULD walk. Our SPSC job was to be so prepared that the company would NOT DARE take the chance of giving us a chance to walk.

Now, do you see why I opposed the timing of the strike authorization vote?

Again my friend, I have to ask.......Really? A strike authorization vote is a strike authorization vote. It authorizes a strike.

It doesn't ratify whatever TA comes off the table. Authorizing a strike gives the MEC the power to call the strike. Nothing more. If the resulting contract is acceptable, you vote to ratify. If not, then you vote no. Simple. Uncomplicated. Non political.

I'll ask you to think about your 2% - 26% comment in another way. What percentage of the group would have allowed the MEC to ratify the TA without a pilot vote? Equating a strike authorization with a ratification would have essentially granted MEC ratification and I have to say that such an action would not have been well received with the rank and file.

next time why not just call me?

PS. I hesitate to add this, but it bears stating so that someone calls me a liar regarding SPC/Family awareness events previous to the strike authorization vote. Yes, those events took place. The committees and leadership that accomplished those events was disbanded by the incoming MEC in March 2008. Any more than that will have to stay private.

You can't be serious. You called me out to show you some data. Your post #5453. I was having a conversation with NedsKid when you chimed in.

..never called you a liar, on this board, to your face or behind your back:-)

Should have realized you were talking about "after" the strike vote:
Thanks for clarifying and I still think the strike was well run/organized.

All stuff I consider water under the bridge. Like someone else mentioned, I appreciate your time and involvement with union work and the position(s) you've held.

Maybe I'm wrong, but I still feel like most want this to be their "last airline to hang their hat".... If we still had one;-)

BTW: next time I'll call.