horrido27

I'll take that bet! (Win Win since a charity will be getting the money!)
While I'd love to have your optimism, I'm more of a realist.
I don't see us having a CBA or Contract Extension (50/50 which way it goes) by then.
Between the upcoming Scope Battle, a new MEC having to be voted in, and the unknown of the world situation.. I'm betting it will be sometime after 2020 before we get anything finalized. [Hope I'm wrong]

Also, keep in mind that for years, we've heard of 14000, 16000, and upwards of 18000 pilots.
Reality is, we have held steady around 12500 pilots give or take a few hundred.

Also, our Mainline aircraft will have grown from 737 to 742 from 2016 to 2017.. but while it's great that we increased by 5, we have actually lowered the number of top paying aircraft.
At the same time, our Regional Fleet has gone from 494 in 2016 to 515 for 2017. Growth of 21.

Would have been great if those 21 RJ's had resulted in 10-12 additional mainline aircraft.

Still waiting and wondering about the used Airbus order. Wonder if it was leaked early and accidentally?! Just read that EasyJet got a bunch of the AirBerlin birds.
Hope they come but won't believe it till I see them parked at the gate in our colors~

Always
Motch

PS) Make A Wish Foundation, both International and NY/NJ Chapter, Special Ops Wounded Warrior Foundation.. 3 good charities~

MasterOfPuppets

How so? We added 33 787 and 14 777-300ERs we parked 21 747s we actually more than doubled the WB aircraft we parked in the last 3 years.

Another 4 787-9s, 14 787-10s and 4 more 777-300ERs next year so the number of top pay aircraft is greatly increasing.

John Carr

Good point.

How about all those AWAC planes?

MasterOfPuppets

how about all those Dash 8s being parked this year at C5? Like I said before I will reserve judgment on the "we increased 50 seaters" until I see the 2018 fleet plan.

There are still 135s headed to the desert this year and non XR/LR 145s headed out.

John Carr

Agreed.

But the discussion revolves around jets and scope.

And how many 135’s were left at XJT? That was a long time ago for me, less than 10? And where do they send that thing, LCH/AEX/MLU Or wherever else they wouldn’t even think of sending a 73/A319? And per the new 5 year CPA, isn’t the 145 count going back up at XJT?

Whats AWAC going to fly, 60?

oldmako

This is likely going to come back to haunt you.

horrido27

I'm quoting 2016 to 2017.. based of our Investor Relations.
2016 2017 End Diff
747 20 0 -20
777 76 88 +12
787 30 33 +3

I'd have to do some digging to find 2015 numbers..

Maybe someone can find the fleet numbers for Jan 2012 and every year thereafter. Would be interesting to see how our fleet has done.

Keep in mind, we've parked the 76-2's and now the 74's. But added the 78's and more/newer 777's. I do believe in the long run (2012-2017) it's net positive for WB's/Higher Pay.

Also, and this is interesting...
Our ISL showed the last guy (exCAL) as number 12155.
Today our Staffing shows that we have 12500 pilots.
Therefore, seems we have grown by 345 pilots over the last 5 years!

Also, #12155 is now #10249 (per Dec Staffing).. meaning we have hired/added 1906 pilots over these past 5 years.
That actually surprised me, as I thought the number would be higher.

Interesting/cool discussion. But again, lets be realists. What are the actual aircraft deliveries scheduled for 2018 (type and month)...
I think it's 4 777's, 3 787's, but not sure about the 73's and any used Airbuses... (you state different numbers)
Hopefully, since we are done with aircraft retirements, any and all aircraft coming in the near future are growth birds. Even with increased crew utilization and reserve efficiency, it should result in growth of the pilot group.
But the question is.. how much so?!
13000 pilots by the end of 2018!? Would be nice~
(12500ish now, 328 suppose to retire in 2018 [and 73 in Nov/Dec of this year].. so 12100ish pilots in 2018 until you add the newhires [NOT returning people].. 900 newhires is what would be needed)

Motch

PS) 13000 pilots and using the the average of someone at 76% being able to hold Capt would mean that everyone from the Legacy carriers would finally be able to bid Capt. Hopefully~

MasterOfPuppets

XJet is supposed to have UP TO 125 they currently have 115. Air Whisky is 65 I think.

MasterOfPuppets

Don't forget Motch although we have only "grown" by 345 pilots we have also brought back 1200+ furloughed pilots that were NOT on property at the time of the merger.

I am not sure about any delivery dates other than the 4 787s that come in DEC 17' - FEB 18' and the 4 777-300ERs that come next year in the 4 quarter. I know we are going to start the 787-10 deliveries in 2018 but I don't know how many and what months.

We have parked 21 747s and taken delivery of 47 new WB since the merger. The 767-200s would not have been at the WB pay scale had they made to the merged airline so they do not count toward the highest pay scale jobs. No matter how you look at it, it would be impossible for anyone to say that we have lost WB pay positions, in fact we have grown them.

the parking of the 757-200s were replaced 1:1 plus extra by 737-900s so the pay/ jobs were a wash and even increased. The only lost higher paying position would be the 767-200s wich were tied with the 767-300s.
Now if you count CALs 737-300/500 we may be down a bit but I'm not up to speed on how many there were at the time of the merger.

John Carr

And how many 50’s are exiting service? -8’s leaving, great. But who/what is AWAC replacing?

If XJT gets the 10-ish more and AWAC is 65, we’ll then....