737 max update...
01-24-2020 | 09:44 AM
#111
Gets Weekends Off
Joined: Jan 2020
Posts: 215
Likes: 0
I have never been a member of a Union where we were taken to court over "Fly The Contract".
I was hired at Trans States Airlines in 2000 and from day one.. when I got my first ALPA Pin.. I said "Fly The Contract".
(I was Sec Tres of our local council in RIC and would do weekly phone messages ending with "Fly The Contract".
Hired at Continental Airlines in Nov 2007 and guess what.. said "Fly The Contract" from day one.
When I joined my last Air Guard unit, I learned "Fly The Contract" from the United, Delta and UPS pilots in our squadron. It was referring to AFI 11C2-5 which was basically our contract!
So for someone/anyone to tell me that because of something that happened at Legacy United back in the 2000's (before I and many of us were there), I am 'not' allowed to say (or write) Fly the Contract.. well, not gonna change.
If I'm a pariah out there and need to eat and drink along on the overnight, no problem.
Getting back to the question-
Has your union ever been sued by your company resulting in a temporary injunction. Hmm... I don't know.
I can find NOTHING on the UAL ALPA Website discussing the past history of United ALPA. I heard it happened but again, only from posts on here and talking to some people who were around back then. (and from being banned from UAL Pilots Forum years ago for writing it! lol)
There must be some 'official' history in the ALPA National archives that discuss it.
Also, interesting that you wrote 'temporary' injunction. So whatever happened is no longer valid?!
Are you an expert that can educate myself, the other LCAL pilots (probably around 3000ish) and the other PMNH's (around 4000ish) on the history. And no one paragraph write-up. Something THAT big MUST require a few pages of reading.. to include the court summary.. Thanks
FS, FP and FtC
Motch
I was hired at Trans States Airlines in 2000 and from day one.. when I got my first ALPA Pin.. I said "Fly The Contract".
(I was Sec Tres of our local council in RIC and would do weekly phone messages ending with "Fly The Contract".
Hired at Continental Airlines in Nov 2007 and guess what.. said "Fly The Contract" from day one.
When I joined my last Air Guard unit, I learned "Fly The Contract" from the United, Delta and UPS pilots in our squadron. It was referring to AFI 11C2-5 which was basically our contract!
So for someone/anyone to tell me that because of something that happened at Legacy United back in the 2000's (before I and many of us were there), I am 'not' allowed to say (or write) Fly the Contract.. well, not gonna change.
If I'm a pariah out there and need to eat and drink along on the overnight, no problem.
Getting back to the question-
Has your union ever been sued by your company resulting in a temporary injunction. Hmm... I don't know.
I can find NOTHING on the UAL ALPA Website discussing the past history of United ALPA. I heard it happened but again, only from posts on here and talking to some people who were around back then. (and from being banned from UAL Pilots Forum years ago for writing it! lol)
There must be some 'official' history in the ALPA National archives that discuss it.
Also, interesting that you wrote 'temporary' injunction. So whatever happened is no longer valid?!
Are you an expert that can educate myself, the other LCAL pilots (probably around 3000ish) and the other PMNH's (around 4000ish) on the history. And no one paragraph write-up. Something THAT big MUST require a few pages of reading.. to include the court summary.. Thanks
FS, FP and FtC
Motch
United Air Lines Inc v. Airline Pilots Association International
01-24-2020 | 10:26 AM
#112
Banned
Joined: Feb 2011
Posts: 1,629
Likes: 0
From: 756 Left Side
Thanks...
Trying to read it now while doing other things but I am going to print it and highlight things.
Already I see vast differences between "Fly The Contract" Then vs. what I mean it to be Now.
Also find it interesting that a District Court came up with these findings. My little bit of legal knowledge tells me different District Courts 'view' things different, and that times change and Judges change.
Hell, we have FAR117 now which we didn't then. We have a Fatigue Committee that meets with the company to determine if the UnfitFD is operational or non operational.
Times are alot different that 2000, and 2007. Interesting that United Management didn't take the Union to court back in 2000.
Anyways.. THANKS for the link!
FS, FP & FtC
Motch
01-24-2020 | 03:12 PM
#114
Line Holder
Joined: Apr 2013
Posts: 42
Likes: 0
Thanks...
Trying to read it now while doing other things but I am going to print it and highlight things.
Already I see vast differences between "Fly The Contract" Then vs. what I mean it to be Now.
Also find it interesting that a District Court came up with these findings. My little bit of legal knowledge tells me different District Courts 'view' things different, and that times change and Judges change.
Hell, we have FAR117 now which we didn't then. We have a Fatigue Committee that meets with the company to determine if the UnfitFD is operational or non operational.
Times are alot different that 2000, and 2007. Interesting that United Management didn't take the Union to court back in 2000.
Anyways.. THANKS for the link!
FS, FP & FtC
Motch
Trying to read it now while doing other things but I am going to print it and highlight things.
Already I see vast differences between "Fly The Contract" Then vs. what I mean it to be Now.
Also find it interesting that a District Court came up with these findings. My little bit of legal knowledge tells me different District Courts 'view' things different, and that times change and Judges change.
Hell, we have FAR117 now which we didn't then. We have a Fatigue Committee that meets with the company to determine if the UnfitFD is operational or non operational.
Times are alot different that 2000, and 2007. Interesting that United Management didn't take the Union to court back in 2000.
Anyways.. THANKS for the link!
FS, FP & FtC
Motch
Find a hobby. Please.
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro
01-24-2020 | 04:35 PM
#115
Line Holder
Joined: Mar 2018
Posts: 1,375
Likes: 56
01-24-2020 | 10:54 PM
#117
Line Holder
Joined: Sep 2019
Posts: 342
Likes: 18
From: B777 CA
The hiring has not (yet) been affected by the Max. Classes beyond April may be changed/numbers reduced/aircraft slots changed (totally a guess on my part here) IF the return to service isn’t until late Fall. I believe there is a bunch of 737 training (new hire and last two vacancy bid driven) for the next three months.
01-25-2020 | 05:35 AM
#118
Gets Weekends Off
Joined: Sep 2017
Posts: 130
Likes: 0
The hiring has not (yet) been affected by the Max. Classes beyond April may be changed/numbers reduced/aircraft slots changed (totally a guess on my part here) IF the return to service isn’t until late Fall. I believe there is a bunch of 737 training (new hire and last two vacancy bid driven) for the next three months.
01-25-2020 | 09:25 AM
#119
Banned
Joined: Feb 2011
Posts: 1,629
Likes: 0
From: 756 Left Side
Got a few hobbies already, thanks.
Just wondering.. what about my posts makes you angry? Why is having discussions about our past and the direction we need to go- disturbing to you that you want me to stop posting?
FS, FP & FtC
Motch
Thanks man.. always interesting when people get upset or want to silence others.. What are they afraid of or what are the protecting?
Gonna be a long contract silly season the way it looks~
Always
FS, FP and FtC
Motch
Considering that 'some' of the Max's we were supposed to get were for growth, there has be an effect. Though, might still be only slight.
I do recall that there was an announcement that they would park some of the older LUAL 75-2 in the Spring of 2020 to be replaced with Max's. Obviously, that can't happen now!
Think we've seen an increase of wibebody transcons AND more domestic flying utilizing the airframes we have. That plus the fact that the company is always looking for used aircraft, I would say that hiring will continue and at a steady pace.
Sure, I get it that it sucks for those trying to get on board.. if we only hire 40 in a month vs 50.. but once the Max fiasco is resolved, we'll make up for the lower numbers with big pushes!
Hang in there..
Oh, and whatever carrier you fly for-
FS, FP and FtC
Motch
Just wondering.. what about my posts makes you angry? Why is having discussions about our past and the direction we need to go- disturbing to you that you want me to stop posting?
FS, FP & FtC
Motch
Gonna be a long contract silly season the way it looks~
Always
FS, FP and FtC
Motch
Considering that 'some' of the Max's we were supposed to get were for growth, there has be an effect. Though, might still be only slight.
I do recall that there was an announcement that they would park some of the older LUAL 75-2 in the Spring of 2020 to be replaced with Max's. Obviously, that can't happen now!
Think we've seen an increase of wibebody transcons AND more domestic flying utilizing the airframes we have. That plus the fact that the company is always looking for used aircraft, I would say that hiring will continue and at a steady pace.
Sure, I get it that it sucks for those trying to get on board.. if we only hire 40 in a month vs 50.. but once the Max fiasco is resolved, we'll make up for the lower numbers with big pushes!
Hang in there..
Oh, and whatever carrier you fly for-
FS, FP and FtC
Motch
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