DAL To UAL
07-06-2023 | 09:01 PM
#41
Widebody
Joined: Apr 2010
Posts: 777
Likes: 0
From: 777 CAP
220 WB (53-767/96-777/71-787) today. At least 5 more 787 next year.
07-06-2023 | 09:34 PM
#42
Line Holder
Joined: May 2019
Posts: 333
Likes: 16
From: 757/767 CA
Dude, you’re putting way to much thought into it. Drive to work, choice over… If you’re worried about DEI and inclusiveness you’re doing it wrong. Progressive-Ness? Come on, man. It’s all the same. Wear a dress, do what you want, they all accept it.
07-06-2023 | 09:36 PM
#43
On Reserve
Joined: Nov 2012
Posts: 114
Likes: 4
From: 787 FO
I'm glad to see this thread because I am in a similar boat.
OP, If I was you I would go to United. Until now I have always lived in base. As a new hire at Delta, I've been having to commute. Its only been a couple months, but I already hate it. It feels like hell compared to what I'm used to, which is home in 40 minutes after stepping off the plane. According to the APC numbers, between now and 2040, Delta will have 6,900 retirements while United will have 8900 retirements. You'll be fine at United when it comes to seniority.
Now as for my predicament.
I originally wanted United but Delta came through for me first. I was already in training at Delta when United invited me to an interview, and they gave me a class date which is coming up. I live in NYC so commuting isn't an issue for me either way. I have 2 major questions:
1. Friends at United are telling me that United wants 28,000 pilots on property by 2030??? That sounds ridiculous and kind of impossible but is it true that that is what they are saying? Is there a solid basis for that or is it just company propaganda? I'm aware I would have better seniority at United long term, but even if that is half true that would be a game changer.
2. My other "pro" in the case for United, is that my impression is that they are relatively more progressive/less resistant to change. Is this true? I am basing this based on word of mouth, their bolder DEI policies, their allowing more individual expression in their flight attendant uniform policies and a history of not being afraid to be the first airline to change/take action. (while Delta always goes for more of a "wait and see what everyone else does" approach. Does my impression have some truth to it, or am I off base?
This one is important to me because... for various reasons I don't exactly fit the traditional old school cookie cutter pilot mold. Pilots are a very homogenous bunch, and some of them can be very "gatekeepy" about it and have some rather inflexible ideas about what it means to be a professional pilot. It is extremely important to me to work someplace long term where I will run into the least resistance and most acceptance. I'm good at what I do, I have a good attitude, but I've only been at Delta a few months and I've already run into a few uncomfortable situations with other pilots. Is it likely to be better for my at United in this regard?
Thank you all!!
OP, If I was you I would go to United. Until now I have always lived in base. As a new hire at Delta, I've been having to commute. Its only been a couple months, but I already hate it. It feels like hell compared to what I'm used to, which is home in 40 minutes after stepping off the plane. According to the APC numbers, between now and 2040, Delta will have 6,900 retirements while United will have 8900 retirements. You'll be fine at United when it comes to seniority.
Now as for my predicament.
I originally wanted United but Delta came through for me first. I was already in training at Delta when United invited me to an interview, and they gave me a class date which is coming up. I live in NYC so commuting isn't an issue for me either way. I have 2 major questions:
1. Friends at United are telling me that United wants 28,000 pilots on property by 2030??? That sounds ridiculous and kind of impossible but is it true that that is what they are saying? Is there a solid basis for that or is it just company propaganda? I'm aware I would have better seniority at United long term, but even if that is half true that would be a game changer.
2. My other "pro" in the case for United, is that my impression is that they are relatively more progressive/less resistant to change. Is this true? I am basing this based on word of mouth, their bolder DEI policies, their allowing more individual expression in their flight attendant uniform policies and a history of not being afraid to be the first airline to change/take action. (while Delta always goes for more of a "wait and see what everyone else does" approach. Does my impression have some truth to it, or am I off base?
This one is important to me because... for various reasons I don't exactly fit the traditional old school cookie cutter pilot mold. Pilots are a very homogenous bunch, and some of them can be very "gatekeepy" about it and have some rather inflexible ideas about what it means to be a professional pilot. It is extremely important to me to work someplace long term where I will run into the least resistance and most acceptance. I'm good at what I do, I have a good attitude, but I've only been at Delta a few months and I've already run into a few uncomfortable situations with other pilots. Is it likely to be better for my at United in this regard?
Thank you all!!
07-06-2023 | 10:39 PM
#44
Gets Weekends Off
Joined: Aug 2015
Posts: 1,561
Likes: 0
From: Captain
220 WB (53-767/96-777/71-787) today. At least 5 more 787 next year.
19000 pilots for 1100 total aircraft
some will be parked of those 767-3 , 777 A and B models ( my guess at least 50 of them by 2028)
and NBs will be add on for a total of 1100 frames (320s and 737-7 and some 737-8s will be parked as well)
07-07-2023 | 12:33 AM
#45
On Reserve
Joined: Feb 2013
Posts: 54
Likes: 1
Reserve in base is great QoL, especially during the winter months. You just don't get used much by picking up SC's. On top of that DEN is poised to be UAL's fortress hub similar to ATL, and obviously there's tons of instructor/evaluator jobs at DENTK.
07-07-2023 | 05:41 AM
#46
Gets Weekends Off
Joined: Dec 2015
Posts: 278
Likes: 0
If hired in 1-2 yrs. with 20 yrs. or 22 yrs. left with age 67. What kind of seniority would one be looking at with United? Where would they retire, what number on the seniority list? I'm sure upgrade on a narrowbody is a reality, right? Would they be able to fly widebodies as an F/O? Could they hold widebody captain? Asking for a friend that doesn't post here and he's trying to decide between DL and UA. Thanks in advance.
07-07-2023 | 06:16 AM
#47
Line Holder
Joined: Oct 2006
Posts: 1,448
Likes: 6
If hired in 1-2 yrs. with 20 yrs. or 22 yrs. left with age 67. What kind of seniority would one be looking at with United? Where would they retire, what number on the seniority list? I'm sure upgrade on a narrowbody is a reality, right? Would they be able to fly widebodies as an F/O? Could they hold widebody captain? Asking for a friend that doesn't post here and he's trying to decide between DL and UA. Thanks in advance.
Having said that, today's new hire will be around 37% seniority in 20 years, considering retirements & no growth. That’s enough to hold a great line as a NBCA or WBFO, & just below being able to hold WBCA at all.
07-07-2023 | 06:54 AM
#48
Line Holder
Joined: May 2023
Posts: 660
Likes: 45
Delta has 74% market share in ATL with zero notable competitors and United has 36% in DEN with Southwest right behind. They're not comparable.
07-07-2023 | 08:12 AM
#49
Gets Weekends Off
Joined: Oct 2015
Posts: 3,195
Likes: 42
From: Gear slinger
If hired in 1-2 yrs. with 20 yrs. or 22 yrs. left with age 67. What kind of seniority would one be looking at with United? Where would they retire, what number on the seniority list? I'm sure upgrade on a narrowbody is a reality, right? Would they be able to fly widebodies as an F/O? Could they hold widebody captain? Asking for a friend that doesn't post here and he's trying to decide between DL and UA. Thanks in advance.
Take the first class date then move to the one where they live in base.
07-07-2023 | 10:55 AM
#50
Line Holder
Joined: Dec 2018
Posts: 1,150
Likes: 9
If hired in 1-2 yrs. with 20 yrs. or 22 yrs. left with age 67. What kind of seniority would one be looking at with United? Where would they retire, what number on the seniority list? I'm sure upgrade on a narrowbody is a reality, right? Would they be able to fly widebodies as an F/O? Could they hold widebody captain? Asking for a friend that doesn't post here and he's trying to decide between DL and UA. Thanks in advance.
nothing else matters in my opinion
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