iahflyr

Everyone seems to forget this. SWA pilots are paid the most because they are the most efficient. UAL will have X amount of dollars to pay enough pilots for the company. We can either be more efficient and make more money (like SWA), or be less efficient and make less money (like we currently do). The company is fine either way. They care about the bottom line. It is our choice which one we are more interested in.

One of my favorite phrases of wisdom is to always try and understand a problem from the other person's point of view. I think everyone needs to understand this before completely shooting down the need for 70 seat jets.

I am all for profit sharing. I would much rather have some sort of control over how much money I would make. I think management would be more interested in paying pilots more when they are doing well, and less when the company is not doing so well. This would help discourage the work slowdowns and ****ing away of efficiency we have noticed more and more. Ask a SWA pilot how much they see this happen over there. And yet we all wonder why they make more money.

MXDUDE

Disregard post #43..

MXDUDE

[QUOTE=MXDUDE;1076912]Many parts of the equation are missing. SWA and UCAL are like apples and oranges(SWA mgmt wants to run a functional corp). When I was a newbie I believed the BS about SWA model of efficiency to justify SWA's contract, but no more. Obviously a contract can be to expensive, but I'm never going to let mgmt poor mouth me into voting on a substandard contract. The fact that the US legacy carriers have a monopoly now makes this even more true. According to mgmt, UCAL's international flying is premium. "than mgmt why am I making 30% less than a SWA pilot with 3-4 fewer days off". Our 777 pilots make less. Yet five years ago SWA's #1 mgmt guy made the same as CAL's #4 guy.

LeeFXDWG

Airline Parties are the two airline subsidiaries and doens't include ALPA joint consent.

Lee

Captain Bligh

WN pilots more "efficient"? Incestial breeding hog excrement.

CAL 777 pilots at one time flew EWR-HKG-EWR as a 3 day trip with an 18 hour layover at the airport. PBS (the value of which was intentionally way understated by management and tremendously under valued by CAL negotiators that caved on Contract '02) builds every line to minimize needed "man days". This past summer I was able to bid more consecutive days off in a row than I have ever been awarded on a month where PBS puts work days immediately adjacent to vacation time.

The key difference is, that the WN pilots are paid incrementally more for additional effort. Our current management expects that effort for no additional compensation and in some cases they try to demand it for nothing, or resort to intimidating it out of pilots.

MXDUDE

Plus one for Bligh......

APC225

I get what you're saying, but let me offer another view.

The current management does not have to intimidate anyone for additional flying. It is done happily, willingly, and with great gusto by numerous VJMs, CAs in right seat, and pilots who have simply given up on the collective. Much of it is done on days off with straight pay.

Through short staffing, natural disaster, and poor planning the current management knows one thing, and one thing alone--the on time checks are still deposited into employee accounts last month, this month, and every month.

13n144e

Your kidding right? That's what this whole merger was about - synergies, or your "efficiencies". And once again we're subsidizing most of them in one way or another. But far be it from management and cool-aid gulpers like yourself to envision repaying the pilot group from the billions in synergies to be made in this merger. Not that I suscribe to the "the pie is only so big" theory (I don't), but please refer to the quarterly profits thread and I think you'll see their "bottom Line" is just fine - to the tune of somewhere north of 8 billion in cash. And you don't think we're efficient enough? Time to repay the concessions both pilot groups have been laboring under for years now...

13n144e

I wonder how the 1400 UAL furloughees felt about the decision to ousource all the UAL 737 flying? Somehow I don't think "wise" would be included in their vocabulary when describing their feelings on the situation. I also have several favorite "phrases of wisdom" I try to impart on guys like you who spend all their time "understanding" management's point of view, but somehow I don't think you'd like to hear them...

13n144e

Profit sharing is not compensation. I do a job as a professional and expect appropriate compensation, not managements leftovers based on some bottom line that can be adjusted and manipulated as they see fit. I will be paid for what I'm worth. Not a single work group has contributed more to L-CAL's profitability (mostly through concessions)then the CAL pilot group. How much profit sharing are we expected to recieve this Feb? ZERO. Profit sharing is tied to contracts and those contracts are, at best, subjective around here and always seem to have passed their amendable date more often than not. I have no clue as to why you think profit sharing would give you "some sort of control" over how much money you make, but you obviously place much more trust in this management than myself and 99% of pilots hired after 1984...