TPA expires, basing changes
10-29-2011 | 07:04 PM
#51
Gets Weekends Off
Joined: Nov 2010
Posts: 426
Likes: 0
From: 787 CA
am all for profit sharing. I would much rather have some sort of control over how much money I would make. I think management would be more interested in paying pilots more when they are doing well, and less when the company is not doing so well. This would help discourage the work slowdowns and ****ing away of efficiency we have noticed more and more. Ask a SWA pilot how much they see this happen over there. And yet we all wonder why they make more money.
Last edited by 13n144e; 10-30-2011 at 04:31 AM.
10-29-2011 | 07:59 PM
#52
Banned
Joined: Jun 2008
Posts: 2,282
Likes: 0
From: A320 Cap
Everyone seems to forget this. SWA pilots are paid the most because they are the most efficient. UAL will have X amount of dollars to pay enough pilots for the company. We can either be more efficient and make more money (like SWA), or be less efficient and make less money (like we currently do). The company is fine either way. They care about the bottom line. It is our choice which one we are more interested in.
One of my favorite phrases of wisdom is to always try and understand a problem from the other person's point of view. I think everyone needs to understand this before completely shooting down the need for 70 seat jets.
I am all for profit sharing. I would much rather have some sort of control over how much money I would make. I think management would be more interested in paying pilots more when they are doing well, and less when the company is not doing so well. This would help discourage the work slowdowns and ****ing away of efficiency we have noticed more and more. Ask a SWA pilot how much they see this happen over there. And yet we all wonder why they make more money.
One of my favorite phrases of wisdom is to always try and understand a problem from the other person's point of view. I think everyone needs to understand this before completely shooting down the need for 70 seat jets.
I am all for profit sharing. I would much rather have some sort of control over how much money I would make. I think management would be more interested in paying pilots more when they are doing well, and less when the company is not doing so well. This would help discourage the work slowdowns and ****ing away of efficiency we have noticed more and more. Ask a SWA pilot how much they see this happen over there. And yet we all wonder why they make more money.
Wow. You have completely derailed
10-29-2011 | 08:01 PM
#53
Don't say Guppy
Joined: Dec 2010
Posts: 1,926
Likes: 0
From: Guppy driver
IAHFLR;
So UCAL schedules me to fly 95 hours a month, and I work 18 days. SWA guys fly the same hours in 13 days. They should get paid more because they are more "efficient"? Maybe the extra hotel money and per diem is given to them?
The days of flying 500 hours a year are gone for most airline pilots. Vacation drop is gone, never to return. If we are all flying 90+ hours a month, where is the efficiency that SW pilots are being paid extra for? I don't get it.
Please enlighten me.
So UCAL schedules me to fly 95 hours a month, and I work 18 days. SWA guys fly the same hours in 13 days. They should get paid more because they are more "efficient"? Maybe the extra hotel money and per diem is given to them?
The days of flying 500 hours a year are gone for most airline pilots. Vacation drop is gone, never to return. If we are all flying 90+ hours a month, where is the efficiency that SW pilots are being paid extra for? I don't get it.
Please enlighten me.
10-29-2011 | 08:07 PM
#54
Don't say Guppy
Joined: Dec 2010
Posts: 1,926
Likes: 0
From: Guppy driver
UCAL pilots are paid less because we ACCEPTED being paid less. When push came to shove, and the company told us our jobs were on the line, we blinked.
Pure and simple. The company now knows that we will always "blink". We have no negotiating power left, and never will until some group of airline pilots grows a pair and fights back.
Since both UAL and CAL pilots have been without a contract for 2+ years, it appears that it won't be us.
Pure and simple. The company now knows that we will always "blink". We have no negotiating power left, and never will until some group of airline pilots grows a pair and fights back.
Since both UAL and CAL pilots have been without a contract for 2+ years, it appears that it won't be us.
10-29-2011 | 08:34 PM
#55
Don't say Guppy
Joined: Dec 2010
Posts: 1,926
Likes: 0
From: Guppy driver
Nine years ago, when the big airline bankruptcies took off after 9/11, me and another UAL pilot had a few beers and talked about the future of the industry, and where the jobs would end up, pay and benefit wise. We made a little side bet.
I thought that the "limit" of pay cuts would be 130 and hour for a narrow body captain and 80 for an FO. My buddy guessed 100 Captain/65 FO. We both based it on the same thing - when the pay got to a certain point, so many FO's would quit they wouldn't be able to staff their cockpits.
I now think that we were both wrong. The pay is approaching 100 Capt/65 FO when corrected for 9 years of inflation. And nobody is quitting.
How low will we go? Who knows. Look at the recall numbers.
I thought that the "limit" of pay cuts would be 130 and hour for a narrow body captain and 80 for an FO. My buddy guessed 100 Captain/65 FO. We both based it on the same thing - when the pay got to a certain point, so many FO's would quit they wouldn't be able to staff their cockpits.
I now think that we were both wrong. The pay is approaching 100 Capt/65 FO when corrected for 9 years of inflation. And nobody is quitting.
How low will we go? Who knows. Look at the recall numbers.
10-30-2011 | 08:47 AM
#56
Gets Weekends Off
Joined: Jun 2008
Posts: 201
Likes: 0
From: F-16
IAHFLR;
So UCAL schedules me to fly 95 hours a month, and I work 18 days. SWA guys fly the same hours in 13 days. They should get paid more because they are more "efficient"? Maybe the extra hotel money and per diem is given to them?
The days of flying 500 hours a year are gone for most airline pilots. Vacation drop is gone, never to return. If we are all flying 90+ hours a month, where is the efficiency that SW pilots are being paid extra for? I don't get it.
Please enlighten me.
So UCAL schedules me to fly 95 hours a month, and I work 18 days. SWA guys fly the same hours in 13 days. They should get paid more because they are more "efficient"? Maybe the extra hotel money and per diem is given to them?
The days of flying 500 hours a year are gone for most airline pilots. Vacation drop is gone, never to return. If we are all flying 90+ hours a month, where is the efficiency that SW pilots are being paid extra for? I don't get it.
Please enlighten me.
10-30-2011 | 02:06 PM
#57
Line Holder
Joined: Jun 2011
Posts: 73
Likes: 0
Nine years ago, when the big airline bankruptcies took off after 9/11, me and another UAL pilot had a few beers and talked about the future of the industry, and where the jobs would end up, pay and benefit wise. We made a little side bet.
I thought that the "limit" of pay cuts would be 130 and hour for a narrow body captain and 80 for an FO. My buddy guessed 100 Captain/65 FO. We both based it on the same thing - when the pay got to a certain point, so many FO's would quit they wouldn't be able to staff their cockpits.
I now think that we were both wrong. The pay is approaching 100 Capt/65 FO when corrected for 9 years of inflation. And nobody is quitting.
How low will we go? Who knows. Look at the recall numbers.
I thought that the "limit" of pay cuts would be 130 and hour for a narrow body captain and 80 for an FO. My buddy guessed 100 Captain/65 FO. We both based it on the same thing - when the pay got to a certain point, so many FO's would quit they wouldn't be able to staff their cockpits.
I now think that we were both wrong. The pay is approaching 100 Capt/65 FO when corrected for 9 years of inflation. And nobody is quitting.
How low will we go? Who knows. Look at the recall numbers.
10-31-2011 | 07:07 AM
#58
Thread Starter
Gets Weekends Off
Joined: Feb 2011
Posts: 3,866
Likes: 0
10-31-2011 | 03:43 PM
#59
Gets Weekends Off
Joined: Jul 2011
Posts: 181
Likes: 0
Originally Posted by flyingfarmer:1076337
If this all pans out as is possible i.e. DEN737, IAH320, etc. I wonder how many "paid" moves this would cause on both sides of the house?
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