Originally Posted by point99orbetter

short bus,
i do believe you are on the right track, but there should be an isl 180 days after a jcba...

Originally Posted by Short Bus Drive

I had to re-read it, and figure out a possible scene, but I see what he is saying. In his example, if a UAL pilot takes the job at CAL, s/he will be making $82/hr (previous pay at UAL). Then the CBA comes along, and year 2 pay goes to $100/hr. The UAL pilot has to wait until s/he has been at CAL (the new UAL) two years until seeing that $90/hr unless something is put in the CBA for longevity (Until the ISL comes along)... NO?

Originally Posted by oldmako

This is a load of fertilizer. A big pay raise would be Contract 2000 wages adjusted for inflation and COLA. As it now stands, even at DAL rates, we're taking it in the shorts and still have everything to lose. There are a significant number of hyper senior pilots flying the left seat of the bus who could hold the left seat of the 67. IF the buses (and probably a mess of guppies) were parked due to a huge "give" in the scope section those Captains would matriculate to the left seat of 67s. The more junior Bus Captains would head for the right seat of the 67,77 and 400 displacing a HUGE number of senior F/Os. Don't forget that there are roughly 3-4 F/O's per Captain due to the bunkie requirement for long range flights. It would absolutely create havoc for the bottom 70ish percent of the airline (sUAL).

The only guys who want to take the money and run are some among the hyper senior crowd (soon to retire) and a handful of spineless Marvins. More and more of the guys I fly with are getting their axe handles ready.

Things are looking very bleak if you ask me. IF the TA is a turd this place ought to implode. There's your happy thought for the day.

**I'm doing my best to not paint the CAL guys with a broad brush because it's destructive and only furthers El Heffe's cause. So I will highlight when the tables are turned.

Originally Posted by APC225

Just wait until the CAL MEC votes yes and the UAL MEC votes no on the TA, and so they dust off DAL's LOA 19 which allows them to implement the new contract with one group but not the other. That will be messed up.

Originally Posted by APC225

Yes, I would say definitely no. The new CBA doesn't have to say anything about UAL+CAL longevity because the UAL new hire already has it now. It doesn't make any sense to then remove his years of service at UAL when a new contract comes out.

Originally Posted by datake

I hope you're right, but I don't think so. Remember, all furloughed United pilots at CAL are simply new hires getting a new CBA. Their previous longevity at United counts for nothing until recall. However, they did allow United pilots who were still on probation to carry over their previous time to minimize their time at CAL on 1st yr pay. That was a new agreement reached after the fact. Maybe that's a case for the other furloughed United pilots to carry over their longevity onto the new payscale without being recalled.

Originally Posted by Scott Stoops

The second we have a contract and an ISL then they take their rightful spot on the list. Depending on the outcome of the SLI, this may or may not have a big effect on the lists. It will certainly effect the voluntary furloughs.

Scott

Originally Posted by Point99orbetter

Billy Madison makes sense!
Time to do a little more homework, datake.

Originally Posted by thor2j

Actually not completely true. If there are no vacancies , even if you awarded the # 1 spot in the whole company you can't come back until that point. It will take years after a seniority list to get everyone back who wants to.