Mitch Rapp05

Really? If a laid off pilot has robust career expectations then an active pilot must have super duper robust career expectations!

APC225

Those are LUAL furloughs vice working LCAL. You didn't see the footnote?

23
---See Addington v. U.S. Airline Pilots Ass'n, 606 F.3d 1174 (9th Cir. 2010) (ordering dismissal of DFR suit on ripeness of banana grounds); U.S. Airline Pilots Ass'n v. AWAPPA, LLC, 615 F.3d 312 (4th Cir. 2010) (affirming dismissal of RICO Ricardo litigation) "Continental Pilots are Children of a Lesser God," et al.

flybynuts

Still should not be able count that time to go ahead of CAL pilots. You were not recalled to your company and it is like you left UAL and went to any other airline. The intent of the LOA was to help get guys back into flying and earning income sooner than later. L-UAL jus started recalling last month. The LOA was not to give leverage for the SLI.

ChrisJT6

Most of sUAL and DAL senior WB Captains were also laid off at least once. So they must have had no career expectations?

uaav8r

Super Duper?.... no. But with 110+ international widebodies, established hubs in Washington, Chicago, Denver, San Francisco and Los Angeles...(I.O.W. a PERFECT route structure) I would say that we were far from the "dying" airline that our new "CO-workers" seem to imply. And for all of you guys who have been screwed over since that horrible September day in 2001, I am truly sorry. My furloughed brothers and sisters...the beer will forever be on me.

Speedtape

Apparently we will never thoroughly flog the whinny out of this old nag , but :

When you're furloughed, you have no career expectations, certainly not relative to an employed pilot at the same airline.
You're not flying one of those "International Wide bodies", you're unemployed. Sorry.

I'd say a CAL 05 who is sitting junior 756 RESV CA, or line holding 737CA has a more robust future than a furloughed guy. Maybe not in your world ...

Not trying to spike the ball here, but CAL in 05 was kinda like getting on at UAL in the late 80's, early 90's. Retirements imminent, aircraft on order ... etc.

If you wanna make the right sizing argument, thats fine. Just produce the documentation, or testimony from Larry and Glenn.

Larry's unoffical testimony has been printed before.

vspeed

+100

Exactly!

Their right sizing argument will not hold any water...to do so would need proof of collusion, to which there is none.

l-ual's argument of CAL not following ALPA merger policy is misguided, as l-ual's dispute and point of order is out of context and intent to its purpose...they are trying to gain a watershed win for furlough longevity and doing so with some slight of hand and selective interpretation the likes of which have not been granted to temporarily unemployed pilots. In addition, one has only to look at the numbers from 2000 on to see which airline was producing equity and which one was bleeding cash.

uaav8r

Well OK,...Captain. But my post was in response to Mitch05's comment that my career expectations as a LUAL guy who was actually still on the property must be "super duper". Well that pretty much descibes me since I've never been furloughed in my 16+ years at OUR airline and so I merely was responding to this "coworkers' " comments. Well, that's great that '05 CAL hires have such robust futures in your eyes. You are correct! They do. They now work for an airline with 700+ jets spanning the globe with 150+ widebodies and a route structure that is second to none. The thing is though, in my eyes, our furloughees, many of whom were hired at OUR airline over 13 years ago should not be stapled below a guy who may very well not have been in this industry on 9-11-01. I'm sorry but I have a problem with that. Luckily, neither you nor I have a say in this matter....LONGEVITY, CAREER EXPECTATION, FLEET/SEAT...period! Let the cards fall where they may.

vspeed

Your demographics are way off and one only has to look at the respective seniority lists to know where everyone was at...

Hired and actively serving are 2 different animals entirely.

Just like the stock market, if you bow out of the market and then buy back in on the upswing, you lose your dollar cost averaging..same can be said when you are temporarily unemployed ie furloughed.

The only reason you were hired in the first place was to to an oversight and poor manpower planning of your respective company to only furlough you a short time later

UAL320

ex·pec·ta·tion noun \ˌek-ˌspek-ˈtā-shən, ik-\


1: the act or state of expecting : anticipation <in expectation of what would happen


sta·tus noun, often attributive \ˈstā-təs, ˈsta-\
plural sta·tus·es

1: position or rank in relation to others <the status of a father>
2 : relative rank in a hierarchy of prestige; especially : high prestige
3: the condition of a person or thing in the eyes of the law
4: state or condition with respect to circumstances