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-   -   trip trade rant #3 (https://www.airlinepilotforums.com/united/83941-trip-trade-rant-3-a.html)

Probe 09-15-2014 11:51 PM

Special deals. Yep. For the second time in 6 months I see a pilot come to my BES, that was not awarded it via displacement or vacancy. This time it was a scab.

There must be some super-secret vacancy awarding process going on as well.

SpecialTracking 09-16-2014 12:35 AM

We need to bring transparency back into the system.

Dave Fitzgerald 09-16-2014 02:38 AM


Originally Posted by Privateer20 (Post 1727849)
Dave: i hear ya. Im all for cutting out the shenanigans. But im usually trying to reduce my sched....impossible now. I cant drop, i cant slide a trip a single day. The trade i spoke of at the beginning of this thread wont work simply because of the technical nature of when each trip starts. I would be curious to know how it works at DAL or AMR... Our current system is worse than the trade capabilities at my former regional job. All because of people gaming the system!?!? Gotta be a way to stop them without restricting the rest of us.

I absolutely agree. If the company wanted real trip trading we would have a better system. Simply unworkable is many situations. What they truly don't understand is the infelxibility leads to a less reliable schedule for them.

Sunvox 09-16-2014 03:40 AM


Originally Posted by SpecialTracking (Post 1727638)
Do not email management with your frustrations! This is very dangerous recommendation. It will serve no purpose except to possibly land you in trouble.



Sorry guys, I disagree and my personal experience is totally different in regards to emailing management. Over the years I have gone directly to our managers to complain about everything from meals to irregular treatment from gate agents and most recently the use of Cost Index on the NAT tracks. I like to think that the email campaign I wrote to people both inside and outside the company may have influenced the subtle change in our FOM language removing the need to use Cost Index on the tracks.

I am not suggesting someone rant angrily. I AM suggesting a simple statement of facts. You would like to trade. You followed all the rules. No trades are ever available and you have been told this is due to "No Coverage" but clearly there is coverage.

Stick to the facts and let folks know you have a problem. In any corporation the facts are your friend.

If our managers never hear from line pilots and only hear complaints coming from ALPA reps then how can they gauge what the real issues are on the line. Again, I want to emphasize ALWAYS be respectful and professional and simply stick to the facts but you should never be afraid to speak the truth whether at work or at home. Of course that doesn't mean you should tell your wife she looks fat . . . that's just stupid :D

APC225 09-16-2014 05:55 AM


Originally Posted by SpecialTracking (Post 1727971)
We need to bring transparency back into the system.

Allowing us to see the reserve pool would be a start.

SpecialTracking 09-16-2014 08:52 AM


Originally Posted by Sunvox (Post 1727995)
Sorry guys, I disagree and my personal experience is totally different in regards to emailing management. Over the years I have gone directly to our managers to complain about everything from meals to irregular treatment from gate agents and most recently the use of Cost Index on the NAT tracks. I like to think that the email campaign I wrote to people both inside and outside the company may have influenced the subtle change in our FOM language removing the need to use Cost Index on the tracks.

I am not suggesting someone rant angrily. I AM suggesting a simple statement of facts. You would like to trade. You followed all the rules. No trades are ever available and you have been told this is due to "No Coverage" but clearly there is coverage.

Stick to the facts and let folks know you have a problem. In any corporation the facts are your friend.

If our managers never hear from line pilots and only hear complaints coming from ALPA reps then how can they gauge what the real issues are on the line. Again, I want to emphasize ALWAYS be respectful and professional and simply stick to the facts but you should never be afraid to speak the truth whether at work or at home. Of course that doesn't mean you should tell your wife she looks fat . . . that's just stupid :D

Management only hears complaints from ALPA? What else can I say but grab your quill and put ink to paper Sunvox. In fact, why don't you head up a letter writing campaign. Start a petition and collect those heartfelt letters about how we can't trade and are upset. I'm sure that will come as a complete and utter surprise to management.

Good effin' grief.

syd111 09-16-2014 09:17 AM


Originally Posted by SpecialTracking (Post 1728180)
Management only hears complaints from ALPA? What else can I say but grab your quill and put ink to paper Sunvox. In fact, why don't you head up a letter writing campaign. Start a petition and collect those heartfelt letters about how we can't trade and are upset. I'm sure that will come as a complete and utter surprise to management.

Good effin' grief.

Was thinking the same thing ST

Really 09-16-2014 09:34 AM


Originally Posted by Sunvox (Post 1727995)
Sorry guys, I disagree and my personal experience is totally different in regards to emailing management. Over the years I have gone directly to our managers to complain about everything from meals to irregular treatment from gate agents and most recently the use of Cost Index on the NAT tracks. I like to think that the email campaign I wrote to people both inside and outside the company may have influenced the subtle change in our FOM language removing the need to use Cost Index on the tracks.

I am not suggesting someone rant angrily. I AM suggesting a simple statement of facts. You would like to trade. You followed all the rules. No trades are ever available and you have been told this is due to "No Coverage" but clearly there is coverage.


Stick to the facts and let folks know you have a problem. In any corporation the facts are your friend.

If our managers never hear from line pilots and only hear complaints coming from ALPA reps then how can they gauge what the real issues are on the line. Again, I want to emphasize ALWAYS be respectful and professional and simply stick to the facts but you should never be afraid to speak the truth whether at work or at home. Of course that doesn't mean you should tell your wife she looks fat . . . that's just stupid :D

Great Post!! I couldn't agree more!! The two things that you're dealing with though is paranoid and hot headed pilots! :eek: I've had the same experience as you. Not that all problems were solved but occasionally they were taken care of. I know I went to the IAH road show that all the Managers came to where pilots expressed many issues to Greg Hart and his people. All I can say is that within days many off those issues were addressed! (i.e.- less 4-day trips, etc.) Just saying, if you keep it professional I've NEVER had an issue.

Blockoutblockin 09-16-2014 10:36 AM


Originally Posted by Sunvox (Post 1727995)
Sorry guys, I disagree and my personal experience is totally different in regards to emailing management. Over the years I have gone directly to our managers to complain about everything from meals to irregular treatment from gate agents and most recently the use of Cost Index on the NAT tracks. I like to think that the email campaign I wrote to people both inside and outside the company may have influenced the subtle change in our FOM language removing the need to use Cost Index on the tracks.

I am not suggesting someone rant angrily. I AM suggesting a simple statement of facts. You would like to trade. You followed all the rules. No trades are ever available and you have been told this is due to "No Coverage" but clearly there is coverage.

Stick to the facts and let folks know you have a problem. In any corporation the facts are your friend.

If our managers never hear from line pilots and only hear complaints coming from ALPA reps then how can they gauge what the real issues are on the line. Again, I want to emphasize ALWAYS be respectful and professional and simply stick to the facts but you should never be afraid to speak the truth whether at work or at home. Of course that doesn't mean you should tell your wife she looks fat . . . that's just stupid :D


Try to get over yourself and get back in line. If you're hell bent to author some "I'll save the day" letter, then send it to your union rep and allow ALPA to do its job.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

beeker 09-16-2014 10:38 AM


Originally Posted by Grumble (Post 1727725)
Are you in EWR? Whats your secret?

iah 737 fo.


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