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Old 06-15-2015 | 08:51 AM
  #21  
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Originally Posted by 130drvr
First rule of negotiating, never take the first offer. There is always something left on the table if you do.
That's absolutely not true.
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Old 06-15-2015 | 10:36 AM
  #22  
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Originally Posted by GoCats67

From what I have seen, the give in the area of Scope is the much bigger deal. While that would take you down to what we have, it looks like a major give to me. To give you an idea of how bad it can be, we currently have a Lufthansa A380 flying LAX-FRA, a 747-800 flying LAX-FRA, and an A340 flying LAX-MUC and we don't have any metal on either of those routes!!!!


.
My above statement got me accused of "cherry picking" in a different forum/thread, so here is how the crappy JV/scope language UA has translates into actually flying. These are the flights between UA hubs and LH hubs

LAX - LH a380,748,a340 --------- UA nothing
SFO - LH a380,a340 -------- UA 744, 744
DEN - LH 744 -------- UA nothing
IAH - LH a380 --------- UA 777, 764
ORD - LH a340,748,748 --------- UA 763,777,777
IAD - LH a330,744,748 --------- UA 764,777,777
EWR - LH 748,a340 ---------- UA 777,764

and also Our co-terminals and former hubs

JFK - LH a330,a380,748 ---------- UA nothing
SEA - LH 744 --------- UA nothing

so without even including JFK or SEA they have 25% more flights and if you compare the two based on seats it is closer to 50%!!!

This is why i would suggest to DL pilots that, unless you are already a 777 Captain (who doesn't give a shoot about those junior to him), you should be avoiding this TA like the plague. It is a widebody job killer rivaled only by the ME carriers. Vote NO!!
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Old 06-15-2015 | 11:01 AM
  #23  
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From: SFO Guppy CA
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Originally Posted by GoCats67
My above statement got me accused of "cherry picking" in a different forum/thread, so here is how the crappy JV/scope language UA has translates into actually flying. These are the flights between UA hubs and LH hubs

LAX - LH a380,748,a340 --------- UA nothing
SFO - LH a380,a340 -------- UA 744, 744
DEN - LH 744 -------- UA nothing
IAH - LH a380 --------- UA 777, 764
ORD - LH a340,748,748 --------- UA 763,777,777
IAD - LH a330,744,748 --------- UA 764,777,777
EWR - LH 748,a340 ---------- UA 777,764

and also Our co-terminals and former hubs

JFK - LH a330,a380,748 ---------- UA nothing
SEA - LH 744 --------- UA nothing

so without even including JFK or SEA they have 25% more flights and if you compare the two based on seats it is closer to 50%!!!

This is why i would suggest to DL pilots that, unless you are already a 777 Captain (who doesn't give a shoot about those junior to him), you should be avoiding this TA like the plague. It is a widebody job killer rivaled only by the ME carriers. Vote NO!!
Totally agree +1
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Old 06-15-2015 | 11:58 AM
  #24  
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They are certainly passionate on the subject. Just one thread on the Delta TA section has over 9,000 posts and over 1,000,000 views. Check it.

Delta TA - Airline Pilot Central Forums
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Old 06-15-2015 | 01:05 PM
  #25  
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From: SFO Guppy CA
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We need to pay close attention to what's going on there because if they ratify that POS, we'll be dealing with their decision. Here's to hoping they vote that POS down!!!!
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Old 06-15-2015 | 04:04 PM
  #26  
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The DAL negotiating committee is on the take and their MEC is a ship of fools! It's a POS because APC forum members say so!! Vote er down!
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Old 06-15-2015 | 05:46 PM
  #27  
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Originally Posted by pilot64golfer
That's absolutely not true.
I am guessing you take the first price on a new car too?
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Old 06-15-2015 | 06:01 PM
  #28  
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Originally Posted by 130drvr
I am guessing you take the first price on a new car too?
Not even a close comparison.

Plus I don't buy new cars. I buy them 3-5 years used for half the price. Let the guy who bought the "new" car take all the depreciation.
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Old 06-15-2015 | 07:59 PM
  #29  
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Originally Posted by 130drvr
I am guessing you take the first price on a new car too?
The line pilot is not the negotiator. It's been through the neg comm. and the MEC.
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Old 06-15-2015 | 08:02 PM
  #30  
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Originally Posted by jsled
The line pilot is not the negotiator. It's been through the neg comm. and the MEC.
The analysis people completely fubar'd the LCA buyoff analysis with certainty... Kept it 1 dimensional while it is multi-dimensional game theory.

DOH!
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