James unless you were in the room negotiating I don't think you can accurately say "we're stupid" and assume we left leverage on the table. The company wants something from us. Badly. Badly enough to give us a large industry leading raise early with no consessions. Did they want it badly enough to give us more? The negotiating team didn't think so. Being flush with cash means NOTHING. UPS, DAL and SWA make our profits looks pitiful and we did WAY better than they did in leverage land

I honestly can't say how I'll vote until I read the whole agreement and consider all other factors.

Thats if the MEC will let you see it before they decide its not enough.

In at least the last 30 years, we probably have more leverage than we have ever had.
The last contract had some other issues that many reluctantly voted in favor of, just to move on. A lot of people said "we will fix that on the next contract". Those times are here now and this is most likely the last time to get any improvements for 3-5 years if we take the extension.
I'm not on reserve and don't plan to be before I retire. People who spout about how they did reserve in the olden days are ridiculous. We didn't used to get special meals, flew 12 hours un-augmented, etc. Should we go back to where only the Captain gets his own room? I could go on and on.
Nobody knows what is in this for sure, but I am guessing the numbers are close. Even the NC does not know what the company will do if we turn this down. I do know (think) that we probably are in a unique situation to get a lot of things fixed.
I called a now retired pilot that was an ALPA member for over 40 years. I asked him how many times in his career the company came to them and wanted to give them a raise with no concessions and then extend the contract 2 years. He asked me how much I had had to drink and if I had access to a car.
To me, we already have 3% coming plus a 2017 raise. The company has never negotiated this fast unless they were asking for concessions. If the numbers are as rumored, I vote to send it back, or start Section 6.

I am really glad none of you guys are on the negotiating committee. Dangle that $ carrot and watch guys trip over others trying to grab as much as they can.

To the ones saying "I'm not on reserve, who cares" I suggest this. You might be confortable in the base, and seat for now. What happens with all these retirements coming up. Someone is going to want to upgrade, change seats, slide into a bigger paying equipment. So just because you are not on reserve today does not mean a thing for tomorrow. Just the fact that the company alone has shown it has a knack for moving aircraft, routes, bases, staffing at a whim. There are some more 787s and 777s and 350s coming up which would be in this contract time frame. If you look a little further down the road I can see where once the company has what it wants it can/will find some loophole to exploit pilots to their benefit. It is already apparent with the abuse of Shortcalls and artificial staffing. If you make QOL improvements on reserve besides requiring more people to staff properly, more people would probably upgrade, or bid larger aircraft sooner, thereby increasing your seniority if you are happy middle of the pack "I'm not on reserve" line guy. So your QOL increases as a by product.

If the company wants something this bad they can and should be expected to pay up with QOL and monetary improvements in our current contract. The CAN afford both.

I would rather work smarter for more money than harder for more money.

I was, was not, was, was not, now am on reserve.

+1

Unless you are a wide body line holder, chances are you will be reserve in the future.

Keep posting this stuff... Newbies like myself need to see it.

If the numbers are true..this is a no brainer...I'm on reserve and it's not bad...

The numbers are good and there is no good reason we should not take this and move on...kudos to the negotiating team.

Nobody is saying "I'm not on reserve so I don't care". Well, most people aren't. What we are saying is voting no doesn't improve your life on reserve. Voting yes doesn't hurt your life on reserve. It's simply a matter of saying that we would rather take this deal that benefits us ALL now and than risk leaving the substantial money on offer on the table and waiting for a long, extended Section 6 (which by the way may STILL not yield any reserve improvements). Again, DAL, SWA, and UPS all have arguably more leverage than we do (they are substantially better performing financially) and they have all floundered in Section 6 negotiations.

For those that say the company wants this deal so badly that they will do anything to get it (not sure if you're suggesting an early expedited Section 6, but I haven't seen that as an option), I promise that there IS a number that they simply aren't going to go over. If they determine the dollars and cents don't add up, they can still take all the new airplanes on the order book and simply park some 747's and 767's earlier than planned. If you've been at LUAL, you've seen that movie more than a few times. To me, this isn't about saying "screw the reserves", it's about saying "we capitalized on leverage that we have and brought substantial gains to the entire pilot group". Of course it would be nice if reserve was completely fixed. It would also be nice if vacation was worth 5 hours, I didn't have to fly a 2 leg all-nighter tonight, all DH's were in 1st class again, and we got rid of PBS, but I realize that none of these things are on the option list right now. It doesn't mean it's not still a good deal for this pilot group

Section 6 has nothing to do with the difference between the two deals. It is all about leverage. DALPA gave away this leverage (FRMS & 117 waivers and extensions) in an LOA before Section 6 negotiations and the UAL MEC almost did with LOA 22. Thankfully the MEC woke up after much prodding from none other than Garry Kravit and voted unanimously against LOA 22. If not for those events we would not have this leverage.