I tried to start a new thread but my profile doesn't allow it for some reason. I created this new profile hoping to repair the problem with no luck. I can only reply to threads so please excuse the thread partial hijack.

I am in a similar situation as the gentlemen considering leaving Delta for UPS.
However, I am a 3 year guy at AAL. I was furloughed and now on a leave of absence.
I start back at AAL in two weeks and UPS around the same time frame.


Big difference is I won't commute to AAL but have to commute to UPS.

I only have 12 years until mandatory retirement.

Goods for AA
-No commute
-Have familiarity
-Mostly daytime
-Lots of retirements in the next few years

Others for AA
-Less stable
-No pension
-Poorly managed

Goods for UPS
-Stability
-Better pay (though takes 4 years to recoup the pay difference starting over)
-Pension

Others for UPS
-First year pay
-Lifetime commuting
-Back side of the clock


****I only have 12 years until I reach mandatory retirement.****

CA upgrade at AAL is approximately 3 more years.
UPS says upgrade to CA is 4.5 years, I think that may be overly optimistic.

Pay difference over 10 years only considering FO pay is 150K; goes up to 306K if stay 12 years.
If upgrade to CA at the earliest possible at both the pay difference is about 300K.

The big pay difference is the pension at UPS. Obviously, the longer I live past retirement the greater the value.

I value anyone's input.

 

Where’s your commute from?

 

We have roughly 1-2 guys your age or older per new hire class. So you won’t stick out like a sore thumb. The pension would provide you with a $54k/yr floor to your budget in retirement which will enable you to allow your investments to continue growing without having to fully shoulder the load of supporting you. Gross retirement savings (401k&B plan) would probably be very similar at both.

All that said, QOL at UPS will not be able to compete with living in domicile at American.

This really boils down to how your retirement investments are doing relative to your financial goals. The only way to increase your tax advantaged retirement contributions above what you can already do at AA is to get a pension. If that pension isn’t going to matter (because you’re already financially set) than stay put. If your finances suffered due to stagnation at a low wage regional, than you probably need to chase the money. Best of luck with the choices you have available to you.

 

You have zero to gain by coming here🤔

 

Where’s your commute from?
CLT

 

Tough one. Commuting makes a big difference. The big difference will be the pension. Assuming $4,800 FDA when you retire x 13 years = $62,400 for the rest of your life (assuming single annuity). And if you upgrade at year 5, which is realistic, add another $100k per year over AA NB Captain pay. So money wise and benefits, UPS wins by the time you retire. But QOL, AA will win.

No fun being junior again, however, AA has shown to be ruthless when the chips are down (not that UPS wouldn’t do the same but while not 100% furlough proof, definitely more stable). I have been a debbie downer on UPS, in all fairness, it is a very good job, and ignoring corporate culture, ‘cause I don’t think AA is any better, do not discard back side of the clock flying. While we do have a fair amount of day flying, you will be flying a lot of back side first couple of years. When you are on north side of 50, your body does not hold up as well as before.

Another advice I give everyone that wants to come here, be sure you are able to sleep well during the day. That has never been a problem for me, but not easy for everyone.

As far as your commute, we have weekday morning and evening flights CLT-SDF, and afternoon, late night SDF-CLT plus AA to supplement, so I can’t imagine being a difficult commute.

Good luck, it is nice to have options.

 

CLT has what, 5 or 6 direct flights a day on AA? Then UPS has their daily’s. Then you can drive in 5.5hrs. Sorry, that’s an easy commute (to SDF) and shouldn’t be a huge factor in your decision.

If you’re looking to maximize the coin, I’d head up to ANC and milk that gravy train for every penny it’s worth.

 

I understand your dilemma.
If you could swing a few days, I would try shadowing as many days as you can jumpseating with us and trying to sleep during the day if you haven't done that before in previous lives. (We really enjoy passenger guys using our jumpseats, you help all of us so much)
I sleep great during the day and really feel for some of the guys and gals that I fly with that can't sleep past 10am. They are toast by the end of the week for sure.
The night stuff (a certainty for quite a while after upgrade) will be a fact of life and many like or adapt to it well, it may be the change you are after.
Good luck with your decision!!

 

For the OP, the union just shot out the latest new hires. All of the legacies are represented in this most recent class, so you are hardly alone in pursuing this course of action.

For the RJ guys, a fair number of guys coming from that background in this class. Including a Compass guy (I thought they went under).

For the ACMI types, Atlas (lots), Kalitta, and Omni all were represented. Thanks once again to Atlas for running UPS’ unofficial flow.

 

You got it Baby, we hook and clean'm, and you Fry'm and their paid well for it. True stuff, glad your doing well tnkr!