Deacon211

Good morning everybody,

I'm checking aboard the site and just had a general question if you don't mind.

What's life like as a UPS new hire?

I guess what I'm asking is for an overall impression (yeah, I know...you're sorry, but you don't do impressions) of what new hire life is like at UPS.

Where do people mostly get sent out of training? Is initial seniority based on age or something else? What kind of trips are you holding?

I know that there a lot of variances here and new hire life is new hire life. I've worked for a few carriers, did the furlough thing, so I understand the crazy world of piloting. But I get the impression that movement is relatively slow at UPS. It would seem then that whatever schedule you get out of training may largely be your schedule for quite some time.

Of course I could totally be wrong about this.

Anyway, would love to hear the input of anyone that had an interest in replying.

Regards,

BoilerUP

I think the answer to that question hinges upon your fleet, domicile, given bid period and if you commute or live in domicile.

Generally speaking, the bottom 4-5% of FOs on SDF-based fleets can expect Reserve A (midnight-noon), Base Trip Lines (mishmash of shorter trips and shorter blocks of days off, sometimes flipping day to night and back), VTO (vacation/training opentime...other airlines call them 'build-ups') or morning turns (out-and-backs).

A junior guy with a non-reserve line who is willing to spend time on the computer can often 'improve' their schedule somewhere between minimally and substantially, again depending on what is going on any given bid and how much opentime is available (and how often you check OT to see what has dropped in to trade with).

As a bottom 10%er on the Airbus I've done RSVA, RSVB (noon-midnight), Base Trip Lines that were 100% day flying, Base Trip lines that were a mix of day/night flying, and morning turns. I could have held the last 2-4 VTOs on many bids, but didn't want to roll the dice on that. I think the bottom of 757 SDF is similar, but have no insight on how bottomfeeder MD11 and Z (international 757) schedules look and less than zero idea about ONT/MIA...and ANC seems to get more senior with each displacement.

FTFF

Pay sux, no doubt. If you average year 1&2 pay under this new contract, $120K is the number that is floating around and looks about accurate from my perspective. Training is a bit long, 2 long months to get to the line then a couple of weeks of OE, but you get a hotel for the duration and it's a positive training environment. Some guys got a month off waiting for SIM and/or OE.

There's a saying around here that the difference between a senior and junior guy isn't the trips they fly, it's the days off. Though basically true, I've been able to get all the school breaks off, most weekends, and was even home for Christmas and Boxing Day. In general, we are all getting at least 14/28 off. Lines vary by fleet but overall it seems the more complicated lines for commuting (base lines) often trickle to the bottom. On the Z and MD, any intl trips look difficult to get from a line award but apparently can be traded into. I don't do reserve but I've heard that Z guys on reserve do a mix of intl and domestic while MD reserves seem to get mostly intl stuff (there are only a few new guys on the MD & none on the 74).

Compared to my peers at the legacies, my QOL has been equal to or better and I fly a lot less. The IPA is a great, tight-knit pilot group which is a huge factor IMO. I've yet to deal with the UPS that generates the negativity found in these forums (though I know it's lurking in the background). I like the bigger blocks of time off and the ease of express cargo operations. All in all its been a good run at the bottom. So far....

Deacon211

Thanks for the answers guys! That actually sounds like a more fluid situation than I was expecting.

I assumed that the junior guys would get shipped off to ANC or maybe ONT to fly the least desirable international lines, but it doesn't sound like this is the case. Much of my question was based on the fact that I live in Louisville and that UPS would have its obvious appeal. However, if I was shipped off to ANC for a couple of years, then that isn't quite the advantage. Not a showstopper by any means. Just something to consider for the QOL portion of the equation.

Is initial seniority based on age? That's definitely in my favor. If it's alphabetical....well, that never worked out for me all that well in the Corps. ;-)

Thanks again guys, and hope there are some 77s or 74-8s in your futures!

navigatro

Initial class seniority is by age (oldest is highest seniority.)

If you live in SDF you can have a pretty good schedule, since lots of the junior schedules suck mostly because they are not commuter friendly.

FTFF

I don't think anyone from this new wave of hiring can hold anything in ANC. There were a few guys holding the MD but that was short lived. ANC trips arent bad at all and the base is out of eyesight from the management clowns in SDF making the commute worth it for a lot of folks.

Deacon211

Thanks again, guys.

All very good things to know. I'm usually a big fan of getting away fron the flagpole. I had run into a couple of 74 guys commuting to ANC and they looked like they were heading off to the sandbox for six months. It's interesting to hear that those spots are pretty desirable and that the trips are good.

I want to say again how much I appreciate the responses. I was making assumptions based on the little info I had and it sounds like I was pretty far off base. Thanks for giving me the straight scoop.

Deacon

Swedish Blender

There are guys living in SDF flying the -400 out of ANC. They can bid layovers and holiday layovers in SDF and get paid to sleep in their own bed.

whalesurfer

74 guys looked like they're going to the sandbox?
You obviously haven't been around Z guys/gals or worst yet, domestic and Airbus drivers? Some of them carry blow up mattresses, blankets and look like they're the Walking Dead going to the sandbox for life. LOL!

ANC used to be the most junior base. That's no longer the case so if you get hired you probably won't get based there. You never know but...
If you truly want to avoid Anchorage tell them during your Indoc that you'd absolutely LOVE to be based in Anchorage. They'll then put you in Miami.
At least that's how it worked in the past, maybe things are changing for the better? ..not sure..

I wasn't planning on being based in ANC (displaced during the furlough) but must say it turned out much better than I ever expected.
For one, the domicile itself is fantastic with a very tight group of people who enjoy their job and who like to hang out and have fun. Also, the trips are actually much nicer than anywhere else in the system. People who live here tend to bid reserve or fly short out-and-backs (ANC-SDF-ANC, ANC-ICN-ANC, etc). So the long or "longer" trips are usually flown by commuters. Crashpad the first year or so makes sense but some people resort to hotels instead.

A good friend who bid back to SDF a couple of years ago is now planning on bidding back to Anchorage. He lives just outside SDF so that alone should tell you the difference between SDF and ANC trips.
Basically your choices are - "suffer" the commute and enjoy your trip or enjoy your drive to work and "suffer" the trip. Yes, it's on oversimplification but you get my point..

Personally, unless we open up a foreign domicile sometimes in the future, which is very doubtful, I will never bid SDF or even any of the other domiciles.

Deacon211

Hehe, it's funny how different a perspective I'm getting here. The couple ANC guys I spoke with, made it seem like a death march to Alaska. No one seemed to say how great it was.

Of course, I met these guys IN SDF and just before their commute. So, they may have not been their most enthusiastic!

Thanks one more time. It's really completely reshaping my impression of life at UPS.