You want to split hairs over less than a 1000 pilot difference? UAL has 2000 less than DAL and almost 3000 less than AA. Do you consider them vastly different airlines? I consider them very similar in size and scope. Even though their route structures vary and their contracts are far from identical, most everyone, lumps them in together as similar airlines. JB and AS are very similar in size, mission, fleet, focus of bases etc. etc.... Again, we can find differences but the companies look very similar. Just because your doppelgänger in Albuquerque maybe doesn’t like mayonnaise on his peanut butter sandwich as much as you do, that doesn’t mean he doesn’t look an awful lot like you.

 

All you need to view is the monthly 8-k found in investor relations. June was the first month of the year I believe that mainline flying wasn’t down 1+%. Meanwhile regional has been up around 10-14%

http://investor.alaskaair.com/financial-information/sec-filings

 

Typically, pilots aspire to leave from the Regionals to go to the Majors because the Terms, Conditions and Compensation (TCCs) are vastly superior..

However over the years, in AS's case, the TCCs has deteriorated so much, that outside of the hourly rate, many Regional Airlines' Terms and Conditions have gotten to be much better than Alaska's - an inversion if you will..

Coupled with that, JetBlue like all the other Majors has a "normal" balance of mixed flying, while AS flying seems to be more heavily slanted towards a Regional type network and there's not much apetite to put their brand out there as a national carrier. And they have said as much....

Across the US, you'd be hard pressed to find someone who DOESN'T KNOW who JetBlue, Delta, American, Southwest or United is.... while we know that outside of the PNW and California, it's the reverse for Alaska - you'd be hard pressed to find someone who KNOWS who we are...

It's this big picture that makes AS look more like a Regional than a Major, and nothing close like a Legacy carrier.... (and yes, I know the Regional vs Major designation has more to do with revenue but that aside, I hope the bigger point is understood).....

 

The relative difference is greater when you are talking 3000 vs 4000 compared to 12,000 to 14,000 so I'm not sure you made quite the point that you intended.

 

You're viewing it from the Airbus which has taken on a majority of short hops. Maybe that's what the 190's role at JB is. On the Boeing it's much different.

 

My only point in this run away thread is that JB and AS are similar airlines. Just like Spirit and Frontier are similar airlines. UAL, AA, DAL are similar airlines. UPS and FedEx are similar airlines. I didn't realize everyone was gonna break out the slide rule and abacus. I keep forgetting I'm talking to a bunch of pilots.

 

Actually I'm not my friend. I've seen the Boeing lines. They are objectively worse than the Airbus!..... and ours are as bad as they are already..... The Boeings are now doing most of the transcons the Airbus used to, but since its a much bigger fleet than ours, proportional to your total flying, you guys are still doing a lot of short hops too..

Whether it's the Airbus or the Boeing doing the majority of the short hops, the point I was trying to make is that compared to the other Major airlines, AS route structure overall is more regional in focus.

My takeaway from the Kool-Aid series, was that they want to own and defend the PNW and now CA with the acquisition of VX, although as they are seeing, the CA market is proving MUCH tougher than they expected....

And apparently, they have lost a LOT of the traction they inherited on the transcons, which was VX's most profitable routes. It seems they thought that by coming in and doing it the AS way, and putting the "superior" Boeings on our transcons, they would win the hearts and minds of the CA flying public. Well, the proof of the pudding was in the eating and the folks did not like the taste, so they decided to take their business to American, JetBlue, United and Delta.....

Historically, AS has not spent the time, energy or other resources to build out the rest of the US like how the other airlines have. Their strength is in their PNW regional network....anything else and we are just a small carrier trying to fake it, till we make it..

We as AS pilots are all collectively doing what we need to, to contribute to this success..... hopefully management is recognizing the deficiencies that exist and are not too myopic, to not make the required adjustments...

 

You guys keep talking about how poorly we’re performing but our upcoming Q2 projections have been increased twice. Everything I’m reading says we’re starting to outperform our expectations. I think we’re gonna be just fine.

You say “Historically” AS hasn’t spent the time to develop outside the PNW. After 9/11, AS was one of the ONLY airlines to develop their route structure and build their network. Expanding to the East Coast and eventually HI. From ‘13-‘18, AS has grown more than most other airlines in the country. Yes, there have been cut backs on unprofitable routes but there has also been added frequency to many East Coast routes and HI recently. To the chagrin of many who enjoyed 24 overnights in some of those places. (cue the boo hiss section regarding 24 hr overnights).

I don’t think AS inherited any traction on transcons, nor was that their intention. They bought gates. That’s about it. Was that a waste of resources? Yes in every sense. To you and I, it seems they could have done much more with the acquisition but we’re not in charge.

As far as those Koolaid sessions you speak of, I had to think for a minute about what you meant. I realize you’re referring to flight path. Those snake oil conventions are so unremarkable I forgot all about it. Most companies do them and most employees don’t give it a second thought.

Anyways, AS and JB are very similar companies.

 

AS bought on airline in 2016 so of course they're going to record strong growth albeit inorganic.. I bet you though, that they would not have bought VX in 2016, if they weren't forced to...

Anyways, I never said we're doing poorly in the sense you just said it. We are doing poorly on transcons but we are profitable overall because of AS' bread and butter regional routes. The company has admitted that...

The company right now is actively trying to drum up support for the transcons as the yields have fell off from what it was upon VX's acquisition and are nowhere near their targets/expectations .. Ask a gate agent about it if you're not familiar with the briefing from mgmnt and what is being done...

 

Aren’t all purchases out of some form of necessity? SW bought AT out of the necessity to grow and compete. Also the necessity to knock off competition. Same thing with all recent mergers. DAL/NW, UAL/CAL, USA/AA/AW.... Do you think these things happened just because there was some cash lying around and the board needed a project to keep them busy? It was necessary for each of these things to happen for the current surviving companies to thrive, stay competitive and exit bankruptcy. I’m sure the individual companies could have struggled through and last a little longer but the companies thought it necessary to combine in order to stay in the game. Same goes for AS. We were doing fine. Making money and holding our own prior to the purchase of VX. You all say the same of VX. Both companies could have stayed the course and muddled through but the buyer and the seller thought it necessary to combine for a better, more competitive future.

AS’ growth is inorganic....no airline in the last decade has grown organically. All the major players besides JB, NK and F9 have gone through mergers. The reason each is so massive is because of inorganic growth. It also took each of those airlines a number of years to fully recognize the benefits of the mergers. Each one experienced an uphill slog at first.

Every company “drums” up business. That’s what $49 fares are. That’s what fire sales and 2 for ones are. You think AS is the only one that “drums” up business? AS is gonna be fine.