Originally Posted by Mea25000 (Post 2129158)

Career expectations? VX was a leveraged start up with 4 X debt to equity. Looking out 5 years there was reasonable doubt if the carrier would even be solvent or not. My w2 for '15 was 283k with an A plan and a 401k... At an airline that had the best asset to debt ratio in the industry, an airline that had been around more then 80 years.. The two career expectations were definitely not the same. All the previous mergers were bankrupt struggling carriers being pieced together all of which at the time of there merger had the same dismal career expectation. The only exception was southwest and AirTran.... And even there AirTran/valuejet had been around for 20 years... And AirTran did not get relative seniority. I paid good money and I bet our attorney will very colorfully distingish the different career expectation we really had.

Originally Posted by Mea25000 (Post 2129158)

Career expectations? VX was a leveraged start up with 4 X debt to equity. Looking out 5 years there was reasonable doubt if the carrier would even be solvent or not. My w2 for '15 was 283k with an A plan and a 401k... At an airline that had the best asset to debt ratio in the industry, an airline that had been around more then 80 years.. The two career expectations were definitely not the same. All the previous mergers were bankrupt struggling carriers being pieced together all of which at the time of there merger had the same dismal career expectation. The only exception was southwest and AirTran.... And even there AirTran/valuejet had been around for 20 years... And AirTran did not get relative seniority. I paid good money and I bet our attorney will very colorfully distingish the different career expectation we really had. It seems all common sense is lost once a deal is announced. If you were to offer any VX pilot there same relative seniority on an AS list (they could just exchange it with a AS pilot who held the same %) 99% of VX pilots would have done it... Reverse that offer and 1% of AS pilots would have jumped at that offer. I think that tells you the difference in career expectation.

Originally Posted by mike734 (Post 2129148)

Just throwing it out there...All this talk of career expectations and our lack of wide body aircraft. Sure, today, but we could certainly use them. We fly 23 full jets to and from Anchorage every day in the summer. We could easily fill a 767 or 787 to and from the islands. I will not be surprised to see wide body aircraft here before I retire. So yeah, I expect to fly them in my career.

Originally Posted by Mea25000 (Post 2129158)

Career expectations? VX was a leveraged start up with 4 X debt to equity. Looking out 5 years there was reasonable doubt if the carrier would even be solvent or not. My w2 for '15 was 283k with an A plan and a 401k... At an airline that had the best asset to debt ratio in the industry, an airline that had been around more then 80 years.. The two career expectations were definitely not the same. All the previous mergers were bankrupt struggling carriers being pieced together all of which at the time of there merger had the same dismal career expectation. The only exception was southwest and AirTran.... And even there AirTran/valuejet had been around for 20 years... And AirTran did not get relative seniority. I paid good money and I bet our attorney will very colorfully distingish the different career expectation we really had. It seems all common sense is lost once a deal is announced. If you were to offer any VX pilot there same relative seniority on an AS list (they could just exchange it with a AS pilot who held the same %) 99% of VX pilots would have done it... Reverse that offer and 1% of AS pilots would have jumped at that offer. I think that tells you the difference in career expectation.

Originally Posted by AJ Crowley (Post 2129186)

That's not career expectations per ALPA merger policy. Career expectations is strictly widebody vs narrowbody. So, no one at AS or VX has any career expectations as far as the merger goes.

Originally Posted by Mea25000 (Post 2129188)

Oh I will get a 3# this year. Unless all premium dries up or I run out of steam��.. Time will tell. I have found in life, bet on the person with the most $$$.. They will have the best attorney!

Originally Posted by GangtaMoose (Post 2129197)

thats not how career expectations works in the alpa merger policy. its based on what you either have on property or have on order by date of merger annoucement. alaska did not and does not have any on property or on order and neither does virgin. this portion of the merger policy is pretty cut n dry because it is negligible with both being the same without widebodies.



jezus people need to read what career expectations are as per the alpa merger policy. it is not any of those things you just said. airline with best asset to debt ratio. lol! seriously dude this isnt what arbitrators look at when it comes to the career expectation tenet. the airtran/southwest situation wasn't the same thing. it could have gone to arbitration but southwest management interfered and the airtran pilots were forced to accept a crappy proposal or be forced to run separate and then bleed dry as the 717s were shipped to delta. that was only allowed because the merger was an alpa merger with a swapa group merger. there really was no governing process. for alaska and virgin since both are alpa, the alpa merger policy applies and the process is spelled out quite clearly. i get it. youre scared because for many of you this is probably the first merger unless you were senior enough to see jet america. just breathe and relax. for those who have been through this rodeo before, there isnt much you can do at this stage and all you are doing is driving your own blood pressure up.



thank you, at least one guy gets it




perhaps. just keep in mind that in literally every single recent binding arbitration award the pilot group that asked for the moon and therefore most unreasonable, was screwed the most in the sli award. buyer beware.

Originally Posted by FlyAK (Post 2129205)

Gantamoose, why have you not responded to my request to post Virgins hiring #'s year by year? I'm not getting the team player vibe from you at all... No matter how much you say you are interested in a unified airline I see that you are only interested in using my numbers without reciprocating... #norespect