Pros and Cons of Allegiant
08-12-2021, 06:48 AM
#115
It's 5 o'clock somewhere
Joined APC: Oct 2020
Posts: 1,862
Originally Posted by RickyP
This is probably the worst airline to work for ...... regional airlines have better work rules and take less abuse than these group!!!!!!
But he's not wrong. Our work rules do suck, we are the lowest paid Airbus pilots in the US, and no management group is more hostile, not even Mesa. Mesa pilots actually get treated better than we do.
This place is a huge pyramid scheme. Those who got in at the beginning have the best job in the world. Those of us in the middle, it's pretty good. Those on the bottom is a sentence of hard labor and little outlook to move up. But they keep getting sold on the life and money at the top, just like Amway and Advocare or all that other BS.
It's also important to realize that each base here is like a miniature airline. You may get hired here and move up quick in FNT, and be a big fish in a little pond, but then realize how junior you are when senior people start transferring in, like eventually happens to all new bases, and you try to transfer and end up at the bottom at an established base and spend more years on reserve.
This airline has major pros and cons. Recruiters will only sell you on the pros. We will tell you the real story. Yes, it's great here if you have seniority. If you don't it's hell because our contract favors the senior like no other. Everyone who considers coming here should make themselves well aware of the pros and cons, because there is zero tolerance of whining from the right seat, especially when every other airline is hiring.
If you get hired now, you will definitely spend some quality time in Flint, Michigan.
It will be years before you get to Florida.
It will be 5+ years before you upgrade. 10-15 years in Florida or the west coast.
08-12-2021, 07:40 AM
#117
It's 5 o'clock somewhere
Joined APC: Oct 2020
Posts: 1,862
Originally Posted by G4er
It’s probably CAIrBear who just made a new account. Always comes on to trash this airline but has been unusually quiet the past couple of weeks....
08-14-2021, 06:28 PM
#119
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Mar 2016
Position: Gear Biatch
Posts: 266
Pros & Cons Update
Ok, so I've posted before the "Updated" Pros and Cons for anyone that's interested. Again, I will do my best to not be slanted, bias, or much less an emotional little b***.
PROS:
1 - The reality is that for many of us that have been here for enough years to be senior enough in our base to hold lines, life is not bad. Could be better of course as always; the grass is always greener right?
2 - Average days off for us line holders is 12-14 days off on really heavy flying months,and14-20 days off on lighter months. Yes, living in base makes a WORLD of difference. Commuting even if you're senior is never fun, much less when all you do is day trips. So you can imagine how it is when you're junior and on reserve.
3 - Pay isn't terrible, yes, we are the lowest paid Airbus pilot for the time being. This will change at some point, you can take that to the bank. But nonetheless, its a livable wage... of course, if you're in debt up you arse then any pay will never be good enough.
4 - Medical benefits are not bad. Could be cheaper per month, but for the coverage it's not bad.
5 - The crews you fly with are 98 to 99% great, you'll form a comradery, and makes those long hard days easier to go deal with. Yes there are a few odd balls, but they are rare.
6 - The flying is over all very easy, can be a bit monotonous at time, but frankly it's an easy job 75 to 90% of the time. Of course, I'm sure the bigger bases deal with more BS than the smaller ones.
7 - Airplanes are overall well maintained. I know, I know, some will say other wise. Most likely the opinion will come from some of the pilots in the larger bases. But anyone that says or implies that we fly POS all the time or that you're pushed into flying something illegal, well, that's just not true.
8 - Lots of growth on the way which means lots of movement, not "conventional" sort of speak, but growth nonetheless.
9 - Our union does a decent job, again, the grass could be greener. But our exco along with the stewards are good guys. Just need a little more "spunk" IMHO.
10 - This is a good place to hang your hat if that's what you wish, or at least it's a great stepping stone if you have "bigger" plans for yourself.
CONS:
1 - Management. I'll leave it at that. Well, I wont; look, they're not evil sort of speak, but the way they operate when they want something can be so spiteful, and frankly poisonous that not only does it kill the morale of many, but it creates a retaliatory work force. They've been know to say sweet things to your ear with a loving smile while while pushing the dagger in your back. So many of us just do our jobs to what is required, and don't go above and beyond for them.
2 - Small base model. Not gonna dive to much into this bc enough has been said. But although the small base concept works great for junior pilots to upgrade, it hoses many of us that all we want is to upgrade in our home base.
3 - Work Rules/Contract in general IMHO need some MAAAAAJOR improvements. Management is more than willing to throw more money at us in pay, 401K matching, yada yada yada, but are not looking to improve work rules. They like to have absolute control.
4 - Bidding "Software", and I use the word software very lightly because it's not a real software program. It's a cookie cutter ******* program that they don't want to give up because they can manipulate and control.
5- Constant, purposeful contract or MOU violations, the just comply then grieve mentality in this place just astounding! Read CON #1.
6- Flight pairings. Although this is not a complete CON, in some of the smaller bases, some of the pairings are 4 leg'rs that are of low value with long duty days. But then again, some pairings are single pairings valued high... like anything else, it all depends on what your seniority can hold.
7- Reserve rules and staffing here SUUUUUUUCK. Because of the business model, and how they like to staff the company reserve coverage is always understaffed, and SOMETIMES almost none-existent. In Destin for example, you can have 7 or 8 flights in the morning and have only one poor bastard covering all of them on R330! You can also have 5 o 6 afternoon pairings, sometimes more and have NO afternoon reserve coverage. And it doesn't matter at all how senior you are on reserve. You will work more than you would on reserve at any other respectable Major Airline.
8- Upgrade time. It doesn't matter if they try to sell you that the upgrade time is fast. You won't upgrade here in a reasonable time unless you're willing to go to another newer, smaller, crappy base. So if you plan on coming here because you currently live in Orlando, FLL, PIE, LAS, LAX, IWA then for the love of everything that's holy, please, stop asking how long before you can upgrade in ANY of the larger bases! The truth is, you probably wont. Some say 10 to 15 years? I'm gonna go with, probably never UNLESS those bases double in size. And even then, if you come on board NOW? you probably wont hold it, and if you do be ready to be on reserve in the back of a Larry limo for the remainder of your career.
9- Small base model, once again, unless you live there and can upgrade there, well...I think we beat that dead horse enough.
So there you go, I'm sure I missed something, but that is the honest truth. Now, I'm gonna answer what you're already wondering. Why am I still here? I'm not a senior captain in any base, I am a senior FO in my base, and yes, I'm one that will take an upgrade in another smaller base and most likely commute to my current home. So why? why in the hell would I do that which I have pointed out as a CON?
Simple, I've already invested 5+ years in this company, I would hate to start fresh elsewhere which would once again make me junior. Being junior at a legacy makes you susceptible to furlough, which will happen again, you can bet on that. My family and I are pretty flexible when it comes to the commute since we homeschool. So we can ride things out while earning more money. As long as my wife is still supporting this, and my kids are well off, then we can do it. This of course is an absolute personal choice, not something that I would recommend because everyone is different, everyone's spouse is different, goals and priorities are different. For now, it works for my family and me.
Best of luck to everyone and anyone that chooses Allegiant as a career or stepping stone. Don't let anyone feed you bull (positive or negative), I've given you a complete, honest and transparent description the the best of my personal ability.
Fly safe.
PROS:
1 - The reality is that for many of us that have been here for enough years to be senior enough in our base to hold lines, life is not bad. Could be better of course as always; the grass is always greener right?
2 - Average days off for us line holders is 12-14 days off on really heavy flying months,and14-20 days off on lighter months. Yes, living in base makes a WORLD of difference. Commuting even if you're senior is never fun, much less when all you do is day trips. So you can imagine how it is when you're junior and on reserve.
3 - Pay isn't terrible, yes, we are the lowest paid Airbus pilot for the time being. This will change at some point, you can take that to the bank. But nonetheless, its a livable wage... of course, if you're in debt up you arse then any pay will never be good enough.
4 - Medical benefits are not bad. Could be cheaper per month, but for the coverage it's not bad.
5 - The crews you fly with are 98 to 99% great, you'll form a comradery, and makes those long hard days easier to go deal with. Yes there are a few odd balls, but they are rare.
6 - The flying is over all very easy, can be a bit monotonous at time, but frankly it's an easy job 75 to 90% of the time. Of course, I'm sure the bigger bases deal with more BS than the smaller ones.
7 - Airplanes are overall well maintained. I know, I know, some will say other wise. Most likely the opinion will come from some of the pilots in the larger bases. But anyone that says or implies that we fly POS all the time or that you're pushed into flying something illegal, well, that's just not true.
8 - Lots of growth on the way which means lots of movement, not "conventional" sort of speak, but growth nonetheless.
9 - Our union does a decent job, again, the grass could be greener. But our exco along with the stewards are good guys. Just need a little more "spunk" IMHO.
10 - This is a good place to hang your hat if that's what you wish, or at least it's a great stepping stone if you have "bigger" plans for yourself.
CONS:
1 - Management. I'll leave it at that. Well, I wont; look, they're not evil sort of speak, but the way they operate when they want something can be so spiteful, and frankly poisonous that not only does it kill the morale of many, but it creates a retaliatory work force. They've been know to say sweet things to your ear with a loving smile while while pushing the dagger in your back. So many of us just do our jobs to what is required, and don't go above and beyond for them.
2 - Small base model. Not gonna dive to much into this bc enough has been said. But although the small base concept works great for junior pilots to upgrade, it hoses many of us that all we want is to upgrade in our home base.
3 - Work Rules/Contract in general IMHO need some MAAAAAJOR improvements. Management is more than willing to throw more money at us in pay, 401K matching, yada yada yada, but are not looking to improve work rules. They like to have absolute control.
4 - Bidding "Software", and I use the word software very lightly because it's not a real software program. It's a cookie cutter ******* program that they don't want to give up because they can manipulate and control.
5- Constant, purposeful contract or MOU violations, the just comply then grieve mentality in this place just astounding! Read CON #1.
6- Flight pairings. Although this is not a complete CON, in some of the smaller bases, some of the pairings are 4 leg'rs that are of low value with long duty days. But then again, some pairings are single pairings valued high... like anything else, it all depends on what your seniority can hold.
7- Reserve rules and staffing here SUUUUUUUCK. Because of the business model, and how they like to staff the company reserve coverage is always understaffed, and SOMETIMES almost none-existent. In Destin for example, you can have 7 or 8 flights in the morning and have only one poor bastard covering all of them on R330! You can also have 5 o 6 afternoon pairings, sometimes more and have NO afternoon reserve coverage. And it doesn't matter at all how senior you are on reserve. You will work more than you would on reserve at any other respectable Major Airline.
8- Upgrade time. It doesn't matter if they try to sell you that the upgrade time is fast. You won't upgrade here in a reasonable time unless you're willing to go to another newer, smaller, crappy base. So if you plan on coming here because you currently live in Orlando, FLL, PIE, LAS, LAX, IWA then for the love of everything that's holy, please, stop asking how long before you can upgrade in ANY of the larger bases! The truth is, you probably wont. Some say 10 to 15 years? I'm gonna go with, probably never UNLESS those bases double in size. And even then, if you come on board NOW? you probably wont hold it, and if you do be ready to be on reserve in the back of a Larry limo for the remainder of your career.
9- Small base model, once again, unless you live there and can upgrade there, well...I think we beat that dead horse enough.
So there you go, I'm sure I missed something, but that is the honest truth. Now, I'm gonna answer what you're already wondering. Why am I still here? I'm not a senior captain in any base, I am a senior FO in my base, and yes, I'm one that will take an upgrade in another smaller base and most likely commute to my current home. So why? why in the hell would I do that which I have pointed out as a CON?
Simple, I've already invested 5+ years in this company, I would hate to start fresh elsewhere which would once again make me junior. Being junior at a legacy makes you susceptible to furlough, which will happen again, you can bet on that. My family and I are pretty flexible when it comes to the commute since we homeschool. So we can ride things out while earning more money. As long as my wife is still supporting this, and my kids are well off, then we can do it. This of course is an absolute personal choice, not something that I would recommend because everyone is different, everyone's spouse is different, goals and priorities are different. For now, it works for my family and me.
Best of luck to everyone and anyone that chooses Allegiant as a career or stepping stone. Don't let anyone feed you bull (positive or negative), I've given you a complete, honest and transparent description the the best of my personal ability.
Fly safe.
08-15-2021, 10:43 AM
#120
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: May 2016
Posts: 1,014
Originally Posted by Captainbfv
Ok, so I've posted before the "Updated" Pros and Cons for anyone that's interested. Again, I will do my best to not be slanted, bias, or much less an emotional little b***.
PROS:
1 - The reality is that for many of us that have been here for enough years to be senior enough in our base to hold lines, life is not bad. Could be better of course as always; the grass is always greener right?
2 - Average days off for us line holders is 12-14 days off on really heavy flying months,and14-20 days off on lighter months. Yes, living in base makes a WORLD of difference. Commuting even if you're senior is never fun, much less when all you do is day trips. So you can imagine how it is when you're junior and on reserve.
3 - Pay isn't terrible, yes, we are the lowest paid Airbus pilot for the time being. This will change at some point, you can take that to the bank. But nonetheless, its a livable wage... of course, if you're in debt up you arse then any pay will never be good enough.
4 - Medical benefits are not bad. Could be cheaper per month, but for the coverage it's not bad.
5 - The crews you fly with are 98 to 99% great, you'll form a comradery, and makes those long hard days easier to go deal with. Yes there are a few odd balls, but they are rare.
6 - The flying is over all very easy, can be a bit monotonous at time, but frankly it's an easy job 75 to 90% of the time. Of course, I'm sure the bigger bases deal with more BS than the smaller ones.
7 - Airplanes are overall well maintained. I know, I know, some will say other wise. Most likely the opinion will come from some of the pilots in the larger bases. But anyone that says or implies that we fly POS all the time or that you're pushed into flying something illegal, well, that's just not true.
8 - Lots of growth on the way which means lots of movement, not "conventional" sort of speak, but growth nonetheless.
9 - Our union does a decent job, again, the grass could be greener. But our exco along with the stewards are good guys. Just need a little more "spunk" IMHO.
10 - This is a good place to hang your hat if that's what you wish, or at least it's a great stepping stone if you have "bigger" plans for yourself.
CONS:
1 - Management. I'll leave it at that. Well, I wont; look, they're not evil sort of speak, but the way they operate when they want something can be so spiteful, and frankly poisonous that not only does it kill the morale of many, but it creates a retaliatory work force. They've been know to say sweet things to your ear with a loving smile while while pushing the dagger in your back. So many of us just do our jobs to what is required, and don't go above and beyond for them.
2 - Small base model. Not gonna dive to much into this bc enough has been said. But although the small base concept works great for junior pilots to upgrade, it hoses many of us that all we want is to upgrade in our home base.
3 - Work Rules/Contract in general IMHO need some MAAAAAJOR improvements. Management is more than willing to throw more money at us in pay, 401K matching, yada yada yada, but are not looking to improve work rules. They like to have absolute control.
4 - Bidding "Software", and I use the word software very lightly because it's not a real software program. It's a cookie cutter ******* program that they don't want to give up because they can manipulate and control.
5- Constant, purposeful contract or MOU violations, the just comply then grieve mentality in this place just astounding! Read CON #1.
6- Flight pairings. Although this is not a complete CON, in some of the smaller bases, some of the pairings are 4 leg'rs that are of low value with long duty days. But then again, some pairings are single pairings valued high... like anything else, it all depends on what your seniority can hold.
7- Reserve rules and staffing here SUUUUUUUCK. Because of the business model, and how they like to staff the company reserve coverage is always understaffed, and SOMETIMES almost none-existent. In Destin for example, you can have 7 or 8 flights in the morning and have only one poor bastard covering all of them on R330! You can also have 5 o 6 afternoon pairings, sometimes more and have NO afternoon reserve coverage. And it doesn't matter at all how senior you are on reserve. You will work more than you would on reserve at any other respectable Major Airline.
8- Upgrade time. It doesn't matter if they try to sell you that the upgrade time is fast. You won't upgrade here in a reasonable time unless you're willing to go to another newer, smaller, crappy base. So if you plan on coming here because you currently live in Orlando, FLL, PIE, LAS, LAX, IWA then for the love of everything that's holy, please, stop asking how long before you can upgrade in ANY of the larger bases! The truth is, you probably wont. Some say 10 to 15 years? I'm gonna go with, probably never UNLESS those bases double in size. And even then, if you come on board NOW? you probably wont hold it, and if you do be ready to be on reserve in the back of a Larry limo for the remainder of your career.
9- Small base model, once again, unless you live there and can upgrade there, well...I think we beat that dead horse enough.
So there you go, I'm sure I missed something, but that is the honest truth. Now, I'm gonna answer what you're already wondering. Why am I still here? I'm not a senior captain in any base, I am a senior FO in my base, and yes, I'm one that will take an upgrade in another smaller base and most likely commute to my current home. So why? why in the hell would I do that which I have pointed out as a CON?
Simple, I've already invested 5+ years in this company, I would hate to start fresh elsewhere which would once again make me junior. Being junior at a legacy makes you susceptible to furlough, which will happen again, you can bet on that. My family and I are pretty flexible when it comes to the commute since we homeschool. So we can ride things out while earning more money. As long as my wife is still supporting this, and my kids are well off, then we can do it. This of course is an absolute personal choice, not something that I would recommend because everyone is different, everyone's spouse is different, goals and priorities are different. For now, it works for my family and me.
Best of luck to everyone and anyone that chooses Allegiant as a career or stepping stone. Don't let anyone feed you bull (positive or negative), I've given you a complete, honest and transparent description the the best of my personal ability.
Fly safe.
PROS:
1 - The reality is that for many of us that have been here for enough years to be senior enough in our base to hold lines, life is not bad. Could be better of course as always; the grass is always greener right?
2 - Average days off for us line holders is 12-14 days off on really heavy flying months,and14-20 days off on lighter months. Yes, living in base makes a WORLD of difference. Commuting even if you're senior is never fun, much less when all you do is day trips. So you can imagine how it is when you're junior and on reserve.
3 - Pay isn't terrible, yes, we are the lowest paid Airbus pilot for the time being. This will change at some point, you can take that to the bank. But nonetheless, its a livable wage... of course, if you're in debt up you arse then any pay will never be good enough.
4 - Medical benefits are not bad. Could be cheaper per month, but for the coverage it's not bad.
5 - The crews you fly with are 98 to 99% great, you'll form a comradery, and makes those long hard days easier to go deal with. Yes there are a few odd balls, but they are rare.
6 - The flying is over all very easy, can be a bit monotonous at time, but frankly it's an easy job 75 to 90% of the time. Of course, I'm sure the bigger bases deal with more BS than the smaller ones.
7 - Airplanes are overall well maintained. I know, I know, some will say other wise. Most likely the opinion will come from some of the pilots in the larger bases. But anyone that says or implies that we fly POS all the time or that you're pushed into flying something illegal, well, that's just not true.
8 - Lots of growth on the way which means lots of movement, not "conventional" sort of speak, but growth nonetheless.
9 - Our union does a decent job, again, the grass could be greener. But our exco along with the stewards are good guys. Just need a little more "spunk" IMHO.
10 - This is a good place to hang your hat if that's what you wish, or at least it's a great stepping stone if you have "bigger" plans for yourself.
CONS:
1 - Management. I'll leave it at that. Well, I wont; look, they're not evil sort of speak, but the way they operate when they want something can be so spiteful, and frankly poisonous that not only does it kill the morale of many, but it creates a retaliatory work force. They've been know to say sweet things to your ear with a loving smile while while pushing the dagger in your back. So many of us just do our jobs to what is required, and don't go above and beyond for them.
2 - Small base model. Not gonna dive to much into this bc enough has been said. But although the small base concept works great for junior pilots to upgrade, it hoses many of us that all we want is to upgrade in our home base.
3 - Work Rules/Contract in general IMHO need some MAAAAAJOR improvements. Management is more than willing to throw more money at us in pay, 401K matching, yada yada yada, but are not looking to improve work rules. They like to have absolute control.
4 - Bidding "Software", and I use the word software very lightly because it's not a real software program. It's a cookie cutter ******* program that they don't want to give up because they can manipulate and control.
5- Constant, purposeful contract or MOU violations, the just comply then grieve mentality in this place just astounding! Read CON #1.
6- Flight pairings. Although this is not a complete CON, in some of the smaller bases, some of the pairings are 4 leg'rs that are of low value with long duty days. But then again, some pairings are single pairings valued high... like anything else, it all depends on what your seniority can hold.
7- Reserve rules and staffing here SUUUUUUUCK. Because of the business model, and how they like to staff the company reserve coverage is always understaffed, and SOMETIMES almost none-existent. In Destin for example, you can have 7 or 8 flights in the morning and have only one poor bastard covering all of them on R330! You can also have 5 o 6 afternoon pairings, sometimes more and have NO afternoon reserve coverage. And it doesn't matter at all how senior you are on reserve. You will work more than you would on reserve at any other respectable Major Airline.
8- Upgrade time. It doesn't matter if they try to sell you that the upgrade time is fast. You won't upgrade here in a reasonable time unless you're willing to go to another newer, smaller, crappy base. So if you plan on coming here because you currently live in Orlando, FLL, PIE, LAS, LAX, IWA then for the love of everything that's holy, please, stop asking how long before you can upgrade in ANY of the larger bases! The truth is, you probably wont. Some say 10 to 15 years? I'm gonna go with, probably never UNLESS those bases double in size. And even then, if you come on board NOW? you probably wont hold it, and if you do be ready to be on reserve in the back of a Larry limo for the remainder of your career.
9- Small base model, once again, unless you live there and can upgrade there, well...I think we beat that dead horse enough.
So there you go, I'm sure I missed something, but that is the honest truth. Now, I'm gonna answer what you're already wondering. Why am I still here? I'm not a senior captain in any base, I am a senior FO in my base, and yes, I'm one that will take an upgrade in another smaller base and most likely commute to my current home. So why? why in the hell would I do that which I have pointed out as a CON?
Simple, I've already invested 5+ years in this company, I would hate to start fresh elsewhere which would once again make me junior. Being junior at a legacy makes you susceptible to furlough, which will happen again, you can bet on that. My family and I are pretty flexible when it comes to the commute since we homeschool. So we can ride things out while earning more money. As long as my wife is still supporting this, and my kids are well off, then we can do it. This of course is an absolute personal choice, not something that I would recommend because everyone is different, everyone's spouse is different, goals and priorities are different. For now, it works for my family and me.
Best of luck to everyone and anyone that chooses Allegiant as a career or stepping stone. Don't let anyone feed you bull (positive or negative), I've given you a complete, honest and transparent description the the best of my personal ability.
Fly safe.
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