The con to point number 1 is that the accrual stops. So essentially GU has given the company the ability to save a ton of money every month. The company will do what is best for them so we most likely will lose money in the long run. The agreement was made when we were understaffed, now we are overstaffed.

On point 3, if you believe that I have some Oceanfront property in Colorado to sell you.

 

“He” is in charge so yes there is indeed a he. I don’t disagree that paying it out is necessarily a bad thing but then the NC better be going for full retro pay or some other kind of sign on bonus. I would’ve much rather have had a 35% raise with the 401k contributions than this stupid retention bonus

 

I have a beach condo so I'm good.

 

This is laughable, we have no credibility with the NMB. We couldn't even get a sit down with them. IBT said we were at an impasse, nothing left to discuss, no possible way to move forward, blah blah blah...

Yet now, miraculously, we are going to give managmeent our first scope, pay, retirement and benefits pass? how does that look to the NMB and the mediator? Four months ago there was nothing left to bargain about; fast forward and now we can bargain over everything? we just wasted a year of negotiations by refusing to give managmeent scope, pay, retirement, etc. and now after asking to be released we are giving management everything they asked for the past ten months and that is somehow a "strategic" move from IBT?

IBT has been completely out manuvuered and shot themselves in the foot over and over and over again. this is just the latest. we have incompetent union representation and incompetent managemment - not a winning combo.

 

Nate, this is the equivalent of management suddenly moving the needle right before March.
"C'mon guys, we're so close....no need for ALPA now!"

 

hahahaha

we are truly taking it from both ends. I can tolerate taking it from my employer who pays me (I expect it).

hard to take it in the @$$ from the union when we pay their salaries.

 

This is spot on. Now let me tell you something. Over the past year, the whole approach from GU and the Negotiating Committee was built on one central idea: don’t put forward a comprehensive proposal. Time and time again, they said, “We’re not gonna horse trade compensation for scheduling,” and they warned that submitting a full proposal would be falling into some kind of trap.

They stuck to that so hard, they even started going after folks in the union who thought a comprehensive proposal was the right move. And you know what? To the company, all of this probably looked like we didn’t have our act together. Like we were desperate, scattered, and not ready to deal seriously.

Now I’ve been around a while, and I’ve seen how these things go. There’s just no way this sudden change in direction came from GU and the NC alone. I’d bet good money there’s pressure coming from higher up. Probably from the International. Trying to finally get something real done for the pilots.

 

Greg went from “We are at an impasse, we won’t negotiate” to, “We were told to go back to the table, proffer was not denied”, to, “Pay out the bonus by this date! And meet outside of mediation so we can show you are comprehensive pass”. It’s like he’s going rogue outside of the NMB.

If I had to guess, the company won’t agree to both. They will wait until the 28th to have the comprehensive pass be seen by all parties in the room. Of course bc of this I also guarantee you that the union will then send comms about how the company is refusing to meet before the 28th, and how it shows that they’re not serious blah blah. Hopefully the comprehensive we pass is something the company is willing to accept or “close the gap”.

Put yourself in the company's shoes, this half drunken Trustee has been not wanting to negotiate and make everything strike worthy. Now he's giving you a deadline to payout the bonus or else? Would you comply? Probably not. GU has a track record of just ********ng things up. Every single big decision he's had to hangle, he fumbles the ball everytime. I think this is a bit more sinister. It's really starting to appear like a money grab. IBT has already realocated 6 mil to the international I heard. Now they want to get their 4 mil from the bonus money.

And yes, like Nate said. WE WASTED A FULL YEAR. I my self, and plenty others told the NC, just pass a comprehensive proposal. They were always against it! Even a few days ago JR refused to do comprehensive proposals to a pilot that basically told him "just put a comprehensive proposal". The following day, comms come out with the word? DING DING "Comprehensive proposal". The other thing to point out, is they want to do it OUTSIDE MEDIATION. WHY? I mean, we know it's all about narratives. I can assure you the company is not going to do anything outside mediation. Just putting 2 and 2 together here, and just my 2 cents.

 

The comp proposal method is not an effective way to negotiate. Cptbfv has been told this but learning has yet to occur. Circling back to captnate's post the NMB knows that these proposal's are not how any union negotiates. You follow the direction of the mediator. If you drop a C.P. you will get a cost analysis constantly thrown back at you during sec 14/15 passes instead of what's standard. I know you already know this but it's easy for the company and yourself to convince other's the union doesn't want a deal using these old tactics so here we are. If people only knew how close we are to that status meeting. If the situation was really laughable that meeting would have been already denied. This situation with the NMB is very similar to WN circa 2023 except for the unity part.

 

Previous life at ALPA carriers comp. proposals were the norm. Never heard they don't work 'till the last few years here with the IBT but I'm sure they know what they're doing; right?