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-   -   APA Fails to Raise the Bar (https://www.airlinepilotforums.com/american/143937-apa-fails-raise-bar.html)

CRJJ 07-30-2023 06:30 PM


Originally Posted by PRS Guitars (Post 3675328)
Thats the thing about IMAX, you’d be way better off getting a spread sheet and running a game-plan than just high flying. High flying alone will get you in IMAX hell, the negative side of IMAX where you get limited to about 75 hours and no free time off. Consider speaking with some experts.

I’m still in training but I’ve been learning IMAX from my best friend, and I can tell at this point that the difference between mastering IMAX or not must be the difference between happy and miserable/I hate AA type of pilots. Looks like literally two different jobs.

CRJCapitan 07-30-2023 06:37 PM


Originally Posted by FangsF15 (Post 3675298)
"Overall value" isn't the gauge. Isom himself is on video saying he was prepared to "match" DL. It's totally disingenuous to say AA didn't match DL, then UA on the vast majority of the bullet points, including pay tables to the penny. It's one long list of "me too" snap-ups.

Thank you for your reasonable take.

Dolphinflyer 07-30-2023 06:42 PM


Originally Posted by Hueypilot (Post 3675306)
I have kids at home, and I'm running into IMAX, although accidentally. Just been running my PPROJ up as high as I can tolerate in order to pay for a home under construction that always seems to be going over budget! Can't wait to slow down once it's completed, however.

No matter what, kids are primary.
You can get sucked into the ultimate "nirvana" IMAX goal, but don't sacrifice time with them for it.

PRS Guitars 07-30-2023 06:57 PM


Originally Posted by CRJJ (Post 3675331)
I’m still in training but I’ve been learning IMAX from my best friend, and I can tell at this point that the difference between mastering IMAX or not must be the difference between happy and miserable/I hate AA type of pilots. Looks like literally two different jobs.

Not true, you don’t have to IMAX to get good QOL. Honestly, most important thing is learn the contract, learn the scheduling tools (PBS, TTS, DOTC), learn to analyze what you can do at your seniority using the PBS Award Report. Also use that report to choose your base if you commute and have options. Figure out the best way to bid a reserve schedule. I’ve flown with many CA’s, and surprisingly many FO’s that have no clue how to bid their schedule, they also don’t care about even trying to improve it.

CRJJ 07-30-2023 07:28 PM


Originally Posted by PRS Guitars (Post 3675339)
Not true, you don’t have to IMAX to get good QOL. Honestly, most important thing is learn the contract, learn the scheduling tools (PBS, TTS, DOTC), learn to analyze what you can do at your seniority using the PBS Award Report. Also use that report to choose your base if you commute and have options. Figure out the best way to bid a reserve schedule. I’ve flown with many CA’s, and surprisingly many FO’s that have no clue how to bid their schedule, they also don’t care about even trying to improve it.

What information do you get on that PBS award report ?

Montcalm 07-30-2023 07:36 PM


Originally Posted by CRJCapitan (Post 3675162)
What are you talking about? AA came out with the most recent AIP on 5/19 and, up until that point, UA pilots were talking on their forum about how little progress that had made in their negotiations. No one will take the time and go back and read the threads, but they’re there.

I don’t care about their TUMI TA if that’s what you’re talking about.

Yes, APA most definitely saved UALPA with our bottom of the industry TA1… 🤦🏻‍♂️

As I said. Absurd.

CRJCapitan 07-30-2023 08:03 PM


Originally Posted by Montcalm (Post 3675353)
Yes, APA most definitely saved UALPA with our bottom of the industry TA1… 🤦🏻‍♂️

As I said. Absurd.

Sequence of events last eight months:

1) December 2022- Delta sets new industry standard with AIP
2) March 2023- Delta TA ratified
3) April 2023-Murmurs of progress/imminent AA deal, not nearly as much progress on UA side
4) May 2023- AA reaches AIP
5) Late May-June 2023- Murmurs of progress on UA side
6) July 2023- UA AIP

The point is not that the AA AIP was industry leading, it was industry matching at best. Having an agreement at all at AA did two things: it gave UALPA leverage because United was now the only one without a pilot agreement, and it gave SK an opportunity to show up RI. You really think the timing is a coincidence? There is little doubt in my mind much of the timing of the UA AIP was to mess with the vote of the AA TA and possibly send us down a potential path of mediation. This is something I felt would happen back in we came out with our AIP/TA. All of timing of what I stated above can be validated with a combination of Google searches and looking at UA threads on this site.

Right now, those in upper management at the legacies are playing chess and we are playing checkers. You have to read between the lines.

Montcalm 07-30-2023 08:45 PM


Originally Posted by CRJCapitan (Post 3675367)
Sequence of events last eight months:

1) December 2022- Delta sets new industry standard with AIP
2) March 2023- Delta TA ratified
3) April 2023-Murmurs of progress/imminent AA deal, not nearly as much progress on UA side
4) May 2023- AA reaches AIP
5) Late May-June 2023- Murmurs of progress on UA side
6) July 2023- UA AIP

The point is not that the AA AIP was industry leading, it was industry matching at best. Having an agreement at all at AA did two things: it gave UALPA leverage because United was now the only one without a pilot agreement, and it gave SK an opportunity to show up RI. You really think the timing is a coincidence? There is little doubt in my mind much of the timing of the UA AIP was to mess with the vote of the AA TA and possibly send us down a potential path of mediation. This is something I felt would happen back in we came out with our AIP/TA. All of timing of what I stated above can be validated with a combination of Google searches and looking at UA threads on this site.

Right now, those in upper management at the legacies are playing chess and we are playing checkers. You have to read between the lines.

Your persistence perplexes me. Airline management infightings aren't linked to our union's failure to keep up with the industry. You're confusing cause and effect.

It appears we lack your divine omniscience. All I witness are the perpetual failings of APA, time and time again, like a recurring bad joke.

PRS Guitars 07-30-2023 08:58 PM


Originally Posted by CRJJ (Post 3675350)
What information do you get on that PBS award report ?

the best thing to do is take a look at it, it’s found where you look at 3xp beta. It will show everybody’s pbs award (their schedule). It shows what layer they were awarded in. The trips are hyperlinked so you can look at the details. It shows everybody’s coverage days either none, or Line Holder (LH) or reserve (LC or SC). It shows what the reserve pilots bid…must off vs prefer off. It shows how many days off Line holders got, and their credit. It shows vacations and training. It shows Line holders TAFB. In general it shows percentages of line holder reserve, MALV etc.

You can look at historical data. I look at old December awards every year to gauge how pilots bid and gauge what I can hold as an example (holiday pay has completely changed bidding behavior though). Otherwise I just look back a month or 2. It can help you manage expectations and also not waste layers bidding stuff you won’t get.

AllYourBaseAreB 07-30-2023 09:04 PM


Originally Posted by FangsF15 (Post 3675298)
"Overall value" isn't the gauge. Isom himself is on video saying he was prepared to "match" DL. It's totally disingenuous to say AA didn't match DL, then UA on the vast majority of the bullet points, including pay tables to the penny. It's one long list of "me too" snap-ups.

For the money people, AA profit sharing will be a fraction of Delta’s due to not having a pilot only pool to payout from


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