eaglefly

The exclusivity extension can be petitioned for early termination by the majority of the creditors as far as I know, but yes, this is far from a done deal. But Horton and Brundage have made enemies of virtually their entire labor force and that's unprecedented at least to this degree since Eastern.

I think ALL of AA labor is simply fed up and perhaps the creditors are too nervous about a future with this much damage. This impending disaster is FAR more then just some disgruntled pilots. It's systemic and has been cultivated for at least a decade.

Tomahawk58

The irony in this engaging discussion is that both Mr Horton and Mr Parker cut their teeth early on the the finance department of AA.

There appears to be some misconception that Mr Parker won't go after cost containment and/or attempt to put a sustained profit model in place. If he's such a great leader, why is there still a split within his own house and an overwhelming rejection of a TA by his own FA's!

I'm truly open to the possibility of an equal merger that plays strength against strength. Doug isn't interested in that and the fact that he wants in all during the course of a BK process is proof positive. He's looking for all the cost cutting he can get.

He's had all the time in the world to pursue a merger with AA over the past decade, where's the beef!

But we pilots are emotional creatures and "we know we're entitled to the very best". A salesman's comes along and says, boys, have I got a deal for you! To chase that marginal dollar, we're willing to chuck it all, while attempting to convince ourselves that this new marriage is just the ticket to nirvana!

I'm just not buying the hype!

eaglefly

I think most are under no illusions that a compensation model for every employee group must be in place that is competitive. AMR is asking the employees (and especially the pilots) to finance Horton's plan, but so far there IS no real plan. Hopefully, Parker may offer something in both business plan and competitive compensation that is successful.

Apparently, AMR believes it CANNOT be competitive with DAL or UAL labor costs and must go drastically below those. Yet (oddly), BOTH those carriers are turning sustained profits with those compensation packages (at least for pilots).

Therefore, as far as I'm concerned either AMR management is an opportunistic, manipulative liar or they are admitting their own inability to manage this carrier. If they cannot do what competing management can do with equal costs, what does that say ?

It says to me, long-term, this management team is just as likely, if not more to put this carrier back in BK. I mean really, if you look at the last 10 years, it's tough to find anything substantive.

Tomahawk58

So, you'd give no credit to US, DAL and UAL's trek through the BK courts as the reason for their current success models(though that arguable in some cases), while at the same time you appear to suggest that AA suck it up and maintain the cost disadvantage relative to our peers.

That's an interesting argument. I guess after going through BK twice in the past decade, you're figuring that Doug and the team have worked out all the kinks in the system by now and things should be fine from here forward!

Maybe so, time will tell!

I do appreciate the discourse and your willingness to engage on the issues.

Best,

Tomahawk58

aa73

Well said, agree 100%. How is it that they endure loss after loss every quarter, yet cash on hand increases? Google Frank Lorenzo's House of Mirrors for the answer.

I still maintain that AA is doomed as a stand-alone carrier. They have lost way too much market share and momentum.

eaglefly

I see those carriers doing things that are outside of BK. First of all, those C11's were 5-8 years ago (a lifetime in the airline industry). During that time, AMR did virtually nothing competitively with their product with the exception of buying hundreds of small RJ's that have become worthless......well, that and stuffing their pockets at every opportunity. The source of the cash to fund that was the 1.8 billion in concessions that were entrusted to them.

If you read Horton's 6,500 page manifesto, it's just a redeux of what they did before, just with larger RJ's and I'm sure more executive gi-gi. Meanwhile, WITH those CURRENT costs, DAL and UAL are making quarterly profits while AMR posts huge losses in C11 where you don't even pay many of your bills and debts. But cash is going UP !

One would have to be a complete sap to overlook the past and present and be a fool to think anything's going to be different in the future at this point. I think most of us are ready to take our chips and try a different table.

FORTL

That isn't Parker's doing. Even as CEO, he is legally powerless to do anything. That split is solely the doing of a group that can't stick to agreed arbitration. It's that emotional thing that was quoted earlier, I guess.

You can count on APA not settling for the pathetic pay rates USAPA East has porked themselves with.

Josephus

"The US pilots have a snap-back provision in place." -Tomahawk

I am not sure, but I think that was shot down. The US pilots hoped for it, but it didn't pan out in court as I understand.

I could be wrong, so a USAir guy could chime in...

NERD

Dramahawk,

Don't you dare compare yourself or AMRs situation to anything you read in Fate is the hunter. That was when the commercial aviation was a fledgling endeavor. The only comparison btw then and now is airplanes. The aviation pioneers of that time, while ruthless were at least trying to improve and grow their creations. The scum that run (have ruined) this industry are out for one thing, and one thing only and that is enriching themselves and a select few. With the exception of LUV they have shown nothing but contempt for the employees and customers. I believe you have stated that you are a mid 80s hire at AA. That says alot about you. The first generation of "shiny jet syndrome". The B scale. Congrats on not getting hired at FDX, NWA, or DAL(probably leaving out some other non B scale airlines) You and your generation are what is wrong with this industry the last 20-25 years. Spineless. Do us all a favor and retire or shutup. Some of us are trying to turn this profession around.

80ktsClamp

The US snapback was shot down in court... similar to every other effort by USAPA.