AAG places new Group 1 aircraft order
02-04-2015, 03:04 PM
#81
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Joined APC: Aug 2014
Position: A320 F/O
Posts: 442
No, instead Parking S80's and replacing many with Group I and since S80 pays the same as Airbus, what's the difference ? No big deal as I said, as even if they ordered 100 or 150, it would be a junior pilot issue, but won't be a problem as you stated because those pilots will still enjoy themselves and be happy to be here, so no worries, yes ?
02-04-2015, 03:41 PM
#82
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Joined APC: Jun 2008
Posts: 8,350
You are correct...it's about the 5-6 year point when Group II FO pulls away.
APA would do well to poll the membership about what issues were most important and attempt to craft a realistic bargain to present to the company. Perhaps higher Group I raises in exchange for slightly lower Group II-IV raises. Put more emphasis on work rules instead of pay rates, and so on.
A lot will depend on the financial and economic landscape in 2020. If times are still the same as now or better, I think the regionals will be hurting for bodies and the mainline may even feel the pinch as qualified new hires avoid AA or leave AA for DL, UA or even WN.
If the economic landscape is dreary, then obviously that will impact our ability to negotiate. We will just have to wait and see.
APA would do well to poll the membership about what issues were most important and attempt to craft a realistic bargain to present to the company. Perhaps higher Group I raises in exchange for slightly lower Group II-IV raises. Put more emphasis on work rules instead of pay rates, and so on.
A lot will depend on the financial and economic landscape in 2020. If times are still the same as now or better, I think the regionals will be hurting for bodies and the mainline may even feel the pinch as qualified new hires avoid AA or leave AA for DL, UA or even WN.
If the economic landscape is dreary, then obviously that will impact our ability to negotiate. We will just have to wait and see.
I like the poll idea. That's to be expected. The majority at 55+ will not likely make sacrifices for the minority Group I though. The important part will be to let the pilots decide in 2020 and put whatever out for a vote. Let majority rule decide our next CBA just like the JCBA.
02-04-2015, 03:44 PM
#84
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Posts: 8,350
02-04-2015, 03:59 PM
#86
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Joined APC: Jul 2005
Position: recalled until the next round of right sizing to optimise synergies
Posts: 199
I then informed you, why they are not in CLT at the moment, and the fact that they have RE PURCHASED some of these 190's
Your conclusion from the fact that they bought 190's back from Republic is "it proves they don't want them".
Brilliant
Oh yea management is in deep trouble in 2020
02-04-2015, 04:00 PM
#87
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Joined APC: Feb 2013
Position: B737
Posts: 1,204
02-04-2015, 04:10 PM
#88
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Posts: 8,350
02-04-2015, 04:16 PM
#89
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Joined APC: Dec 2013
Position: A320 CA
Posts: 2,300
But I do believe the E190 is unpopular for two reasons: 1) It's based in PHL, arguably our most junior domicile. 2) It's mostly used for shuttle flying, which isn't what most people like doing.
Base it elsewhere and have it pick up other routes that the RJs are flying (like CLT-LIT or other medium-sized cities) and trips like that are much better than the PHL-LGA-BOS shuttle trips. I have a feeling E190 CA slots at other bases doing other types of work would probably be easier to fill
I can't speak for any other 190 F/O's, but will disagree.
1. As a commuter the base location is irrelevant (I want to be where I can hold a line).
2. I actually like shuttle flying. There aren't any red eyes, I've never seen a 4 day under 20 hours, and very few three days under 15.
For me it comes down to the pay. 2 years of 1st year pay (in the right seat). For Capts after year 2 it only pays marginally more than group 2 FO (and less after a few years!) and you'll be on reserve. Not worth the extra a$$ pain of being a capt. If you're going to be on reserve, might as well be on a group 3 or 4 aircraft as an FO and get paid much higher.
It's a fine jet for year one (pays the same as any other group) and I enjoyed it, fortunately there is movement and I'm bailing to group 2, but someday the hiring will stop and new hire FO's could be stuck on it for years. They will have a vastly lower income than their peers that were lucky enough to get a group 2 jet right off the bat.
And please understand that anyone hired after Dec 2013 will not be pay protected for dropping down to group 1.
02-04-2015, 04:20 PM
#90
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Joined APC: Feb 2013
Position: B737
Posts: 1,204
First they didn't want them because they don't have the in CLT.
I then informed you, why they are not in CLT at the moment, and the fact that they have RE PURCHASED some of these 190's
Your conclusion from the fact that they bought 190's back from Republic is "it proves they don't want them".
Brilliant
Oh yea management is in deep trouble in 2020
I then informed you, why they are not in CLT at the moment, and the fact that they have RE PURCHASED some of these 190's
Your conclusion from the fact that they bought 190's back from Republic is "it proves they don't want them".
Brilliant
Oh yea management is in deep trouble in 2020
No one said management is in "trouble" in 2020. Working out a deal with management doesn't mean we need to hand them their a$$es on a plate...and I'm pretty sure that unless something out of the ordinary happens that puts them in a bind (i.e., the staffing situation gets out of control...possible but not extremely likely), they will almost always be in the driver's seat in any negotiations.
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