Atlas 767 went down in Houston

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03-19-2019, 01:26 PM

#911

ColdWhiskey

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Joined APC: Jul 2009

Posts: 410

Quote:

Originally Posted by Hacker15e

Be careful with absolutes like this, because they're not correct in all circumstances. Nose low with low airspeed, and nose low with high airspeed are different conditions that require different responses.

Idle power isn't always the answer, and full power won't always increase the turn radius.

Hacker is absolutely correct with this statement. Thank you for the added clarification.

Regarding this situation, with a -49 pitch attitude, airspeed accelerating through 430 kts (nearly 100 past red line), thrust reduced to IDLE would be the proper response, and result in the least amount of continued altitude loss.

03-19-2019, 01:38 PM

#912

chi05

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Joined APC: Apr 2011

Posts: 128

Quote:

Originally Posted by Nightflyer

Uh huh. Tell that to the 737 Max drivers. I am not sure they will agree.

Cut switches, yes, but I don't believe the opposite control pressure for one second.

Opposite control pressure doesn’t inhibit the MCAS trimming on the 737 Max.

03-19-2019, 01:52 PM

#913

Rahlifer

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Joined APC: Jan 2015

Posts: 571

Quote:

Originally Posted by Hacker15e

Outside of the fact that there is no level of experience or training that makes one insusceptible to human errors of perception, decisionmaking, or execution, you may want to consider what drives you to think that a "121 crew" is any different than any other type of pilot in terms of such errors.

I don't find that there is anything about the experience or knowledge requisites required to become a 121 pilot, or the training that a 121 pilot receives, that would make them more resistant to error than any other pilot of similar experience or training.

I’m in no way claiming that a 121 crew is above making human errors. But there is a bit of difference in the training that a professional flight crew goes through as opposed to joe private pilot. We practice severe upset recoveries in the sim so we hopefully have a better than average chance should we encounter the real thing out on the line. There’s other bits of ground school stuff too that I probably shouldn’t blather on about on a public forum. The original comment I responded to more accurately described a VFR pilot finding himself in IMC then proceeding to rip the wings off the airplane.

03-19-2019, 02:39 PM

#914

ICUROOK

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Joined APC: Sep 2018

Posts: 215

Word is the CA accidentally hit the TOGA button when reaching to set the flaps, then overreacted in the correction resulting in the dive. Explains the initial nose up pitch.

03-19-2019, 02:49 PM

#915

Nightflyer

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Joined APC: Mar 2006

Position: Crewmember

Posts: 1,381

Quote:

Originally Posted by chi05

Opposite control pressure doesn’t inhibit the MCAS trimming on the 737 Max.

That's kind of what I thought and thus my point.

Thanks for the info.

03-19-2019, 03:09 PM

#916

G550Guy

Banned

Joined APC: Sep 2015

Position: MD-11 FO

Posts: 493

Quote:

Originally Posted by Hacker15e

I don't find that there is anything about the experience or knowledge requisites required to become a 121 pilot, or the training that a 121 pilot receives, that would make them more resistant to error than any other pilot of similar experience or training.

Other than 60+ years of worldwide, detailed accident investigations and analytical studies that prove P121 operations are the safest and least deadly flight operations in the world..... by a far margin.

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