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Old 08-12-2023, 03:19 AM
  #20061  
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Thank you.
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Old 08-12-2023, 03:33 AM
  #20062  
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Originally Posted by tfranks9214
Here's a rather silly question. How competitive is 1,300 hours with an F-18 background? Starting the search after the military life?

The term "competitive" is the hard part to quantify. You will get a job, but I am speaking out of turn regarding Atlas. I don't have that information so please forgive me if I am off point.

My thoughts are that you have more than enough for restricted atp, but you will still need ATPCTP. Atlas has one: https://www.atlasairtrainingcenter.com/atp-ctp/

For what it is worth, VA benefits can be used to pay for a 747 type rating, or at least I have seen it on one of the government sites.

There is probably a program to pay for the ATPCTP course with GI Bill or some other military/veteran program.

It seems like everyone has a military transition program. If you're going to be CONUS in October, I think Atlas is going to be at RTAG in Ft Worth. Might be good chance to get face to face. Reach out to [[email protected]]

I hope I said something useful.
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Old 08-12-2023, 04:54 AM
  #20063  
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Originally Posted by Purpo
The term "competitive" is the hard part to quantify. You will get a job, but I am speaking out of turn regarding Atlas. I don't have that information so please forgive me if I am off point.

My thoughts are that you have more than enough for restricted atp, but you will still need ATPCTP. Atlas has one: https://www.atlasairtrainingcenter.com/atp-ctp/

For what it is worth, VA benefits can be used to pay for a 747 type rating, or at least I have seen it on one of the government sites.

There is probably a program to pay for the ATPCTP course with GI Bill or some other military/veteran program.

It seems like everyone has a military transition program. If you're going to be CONUS in October, I think Atlas is going to be at RTAG in Ft Worth. Might be good chance to get face to face. Reach out to [[email protected]]

I hope I said something useful.
I would just caution to not conflate a 747 type rating with an ATP.

Those are two separate certificates. Theoretically, a private pilot can earn a 747 type rating. Likewise, you can earn a single engine ATP. Neither option is very useful, but it's legal.

Whether or not an applicant should earn an ATP before applying is not my business to say, but personally, I wouldn't waste any time or money on a 747 type rating for two reasons:

1) The new hire will have to complete the entire Atlas 747 type rating course anyway. Pass or Fail.
2) You'll probably just confuse yourself due to "Law of Primacy" when differences emerge between the generic type rating and the specific Atlas training.
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Old 08-13-2023, 07:49 AM
  #20064  
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Originally Posted by zerozero
I would just caution to not conflate a 747 type rating with an ATP.

Those are two separate certificates. Theoretically, a private pilot can earn a 747 type rating. Likewise, you can earn a single engine ATP. Neither option is very useful, but it's legal.

Whether or not an applicant should earn an ATP before applying is not my business to say, but personally, I wouldn't waste any time or money on a 747 type rating for two reasons:

1) The new hire will have to complete the entire Atlas 747 type rating course anyway. Pass or Fail.
2) You'll probably just confuse yourself due to "Law of Primacy" when differences emerge between the generic type rating and the specific Atlas training.


All good points, Skipper. I agree with you completely.

I sort of rambled and probably could have written it better. Regarding the ATP, at no point did I intimate or intend to conflate the ATP with any rating.

I was talking about veteran education benefits.

The point was that IF veteran benefits will pay for a type rating, then they might also pay for the ATPCTP with the same funding programs.

That's really what I was getting at...
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Old 08-13-2023, 09:03 PM
  #20065  
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Originally Posted by zerozero
You'll probably just confuse yourself due to "Law of Primacy" when differences emerge between the generic type rating and the specific Atlas training.
This is BS. The law of primacy is BS. You can easily remove from your brain what you dont want, and learn the new ways. I've flown the same plane with 3 different airlines with different ways of each, and did not have any problem at all switching it all around.
If you cant do that, maybe you just shouldn't be a pilot.
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Old 08-13-2023, 09:18 PM
  #20066  
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Originally Posted by crjflyer0023
This is BS. The law of primacy is BS. You can easily remove from your brain what you dont want, and learn the new ways. I've flown the same plane with 3 different airlines with different ways of each, and did not have any problem at all switching it all around.
If you cant do that, maybe you just shouldn't be a pilot.
Spoken like a new guy with one type rating and very little experience. Zero big airplane experience, right?
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Old 08-14-2023, 05:05 AM
  #20067  
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Originally Posted by crjflyer0023
This is BS. The law of primacy is BS. You can easily remove from your brain what you dont want, and learn the new ways. I've flown the same plane with 3 different airlines with different ways of each, and did not have any problem at all switching it all around.
If you cant do that, maybe you just shouldn't be a pilot.
It's okay and helpful to study ahead, but you need to be aware of potential pitfalls. If you're not aware of pitfalls, it's best to wait. I think Zero is saying you should be careful you don't screw yourself up, and only you know how your mind works. As for the law of Primacy, it is definitely not BS. You gotta respect the way your brain works, but you also have to respect the way your crew's brains work. So if you think you'll benefit from leaning in early, do so. Just make sure you can approach the material in a way that doesn't contaminate what you need to know with what you already know.

Taking a type rating course somewhere else is overkill and probably negative training.
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Old 08-14-2023, 02:45 PM
  #20068  
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Originally Posted by crjflyer0023
This is BS. The law of primacy is BS. You can easily remove from your brain what you dont want, and learn the new ways. I've flown the same plane with 3 different airlines with different ways of each, and did not have any problem at all switching it all around.
If you cant do that, maybe you just shouldn't be a pilot.
Oh we’ve got an arrogant one here. It’s called a LAW for a reason. Meanwhile, you are a relative baby in the industry and you appear to have flown nothing bigger than a dinky, phallic-shaped crj.

Universally, bad attitudes and unchecked arrogance drive the most failures in training. You will do well to sit down, shut up, and gain wisdom before arrogantly declaring long-held truths as “BS”.
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Old 08-15-2023, 09:36 AM
  #20069  
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Originally Posted by crjflyer0023
This is BS. The law of primacy is BS. You can easily remove from your brain what you dont want, and learn the new ways. I've flown the same plane with 3 different airlines with different ways of each, and did not have any problem at all switching it all around.
If you cant do that, maybe you just shouldn't be a pilot.
Then you're the exception rather than the rule. The most non-standard guys I've ever seen - in and out of the sim - were the ones with 2-3 different airlines flying the same type. They all thought they were God's gift too, but not having flown with you, I'll take your word for it, and congratulate you on being the exception to the rule.
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Old 08-15-2023, 02:09 PM
  #20070  
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Originally Posted by crjflyer0023
This is BS. The law of primacy is BS. You can easily remove from your brain what you dont want, and learn the new ways. I've flown the same plane with 3 different airlines with different ways of each, and did not have any problem at all switching it all around.
If you cant do that, maybe you just shouldn't be a pilot.
The fact that you admit the need to remove info from your brain to learn a different technique only reinforces the “LAW” of primacy. It takes effort to undo fundamental learning and retrain the brain. It just so happens that all my years as a weapons and small unit tactics instructor in the military was predicated on teaching fundamentals. Didn’t matter what unit, tier, or branch of service, the primacy of proper fundamentals was the single most important building block to good outcomes on two-way gun ranges. I dare say that your arrogance is dangerous both in my former life as well as in our current lives in aviation.
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